Who's Harold Konigsberg talking about?

[JoelTurner]

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Konigsberg mentions 3 unnamed individuals whom he refers to as Genovese captains:

Unsub 1 - California

- Born ~1897 in Tufino, Italy
- Dark complexion, big nose, glasses
- Lawyer in 1958

Unsub 2 - Montana

- Born ~1901
- Lived in a town where "all the unions are located"
- Short brown hair, non-Italian looking

Unsub 3 - Seattle, WA

- Paul LNU

Both the individuals in Montana and Seattle, WA reported to the one in California whom he referred to as a general captain.

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Konigsberg had been inaccurate or out right lied in the past. However, unlike some of his other stories which he was repeating, he claims to have actually met Unubs 1 & 2.

Also, Konigsberg had a fairly decent understanding of who was in which family. He had a good knowledge of the Genovese family and knew a lot of their members.

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I don't personally think that the men that he met were Genovese members let alone captains. I don't know who he met, but this is intriguing.

[B.]

I agree this set of claims is highly questionable.

The lawyer in California is probably Frank Desimone although he wasn't Neapolitan but 100% Sicilian, parents from Salaparuta and Lucca Sicula. He did have a big nose and glasses though that describes countless members.

There were remote members in unlikely places like Senator Louis Boschetto in Wyoming, who might have been under Colorado, so I'm open to the existence of obscure members in weird places I just think these particular claims need more substance or context.

[JoelTurner]

I thought about Frank Desimone too because of he fits the California/Lawyer/Mafia part but the age is pretty off. He was over a decade younger than Genovese and Unsub 1.

Not much info on Unsub 3, I don’t think there was much activity in that area. Frank Colacurcio is called boss of the Seattle family online but they weren’t LCN

[B.]

I doubt Konigsberg had a perfect read on anyone's age unless he was explicitly told a number. A four-eyed California lawyer who he perceived as a "general captain" over other captains during the period Desimone was boss fits him better than other known names. The strangest thing is the belief that he was a paesan of Genovese as that's highly specific but we know a couple source mistakenly believed Sam Giancana was Neapolitan so who knows what led Konigsberg to report that detail.

The report brings to mind the Newark CI who visited Venezuela with Paterno and said there were two Gambino captains there. There were in fact two Sicilian mafia capidecine there at the time representing Santa Ninfa and Siculiana so he looks to have confused their affiliation but the basic idea has some substance. With Konigsberg I don't see why he'd invent this info and it's possible he did meet mafiosi who had interests in those areas but his recollection is probably erroneous in more ways than one.

I'd have to dig into his other cooperation again, but didn't Konigsberg make some mistakes w/ Family affiliation even in NJ / NYC?

[sisterray]

I have to admit I’m not familiar with Konigsberg but if he indeed met with DeSimone, wouldn’t point out to his ptosis as a distinctive feature rather than a „dark complexion”?

[JoelTurner]

It does fit Desimone even if other aspects clash, that would imply that the guys in Montana and Seattle were aligned with or members of the LA family. As for his eye, I guess it depends on what he remembered.

[CornerBoy]

Very interesting aside from the fact that KO is a notorious bullshitter and rat so he could have invented these guys to make himself more indispensable to the POlice. I've read that he was a complete ffucking nut. A friends grandfather said he knew him tangentially and told some stories about the old days in Bayonne. He was under impression that KO was w the Bonanno's if I remember correctly. Literally a Ten min convo, if that.

[JoelTurner]

He was a Bonanno associate.

In terms of BS-ing, I think he was lying about how much he knew about certain crimes like the Anthony Strollo hit.

This is totally out of left field; I don’t think he’s lying but I don’t really know what to make of it.

The Venezuela thing is interesting too. Theoretically, the informant should have realized that it’s a different group just like Kayo should have been able to tell that some guy in Montana wasn’t a Genovese capo.

[davidf1989]

Why did Konisberg become an informant?

[CornerBoy]

probably some perceived slight

When he was released after 50 years or something crazy, he terrorized his neighbors at age 90. someone pls correct me if I'm wrong.

Total pyscho or sociopath whatever the fuck or so his nephew says w no remorse, a serial prevaricator, cruel man w no empathy for his fellow man

[JoelTurner]

Yup, he was a real nut. He was picked up for shop lifting and was terrorizing the other residents at his senior assisted-living facility.