HOFFA...again...

[Snakes]

Would be hilarious if eventually some noboby who claims to know where Hoffa is burried actually tells the truth and they find the body.

I would have to assume at this point that the mobsters who actually know what happened to him (and I contend there is less than 3 people who actually know the deatils) are now deceased. While orders may have been given, the details of the crime are buried with whoever carried it out. The mafia isn't that good at keeping secrets, especially for 40+ years. While I believe that Provenzano, Bufalino, the Giacalone Brothers were certainly part of the crime, I have no reason to believe they were there watching the crime take place. Chucky O'Brien is the only source at this point who would have any inside information (if he knows anything).

**I certainly DO NOT BELIEVE that they transported one of the highest profile union leader across many state lines to take him and bury him in New Jersey. We know approximately where he was killed, but the burial was pre planned and not outside Michigan. Salvage yards around the Detroit area were perfect places to have him crushed into metal.

Not sure what your basing your assumption in that the people that know what happened are all dead. According to the fbi the two guys I mentioned above were there so they would know what happened and they are alive. Again according to the fbi they were just as involved as chucky

http://articles.latimes.com/1985-07-27/ ... my-hoffa/2

The masterminds behind the hit are long dead...and although Andretta and Bruglio are still alive, there hasn't been enough evidence to bring an indictment. One other reason I have a hard time believing it is because a high profile hit like Hoffa makes it hard for me to believe that the masterminds didn't "cut all ties" with the guys who did the heavy work. Personally, I don't believe that if the masterminds were people like Provenzano, Bufalino, Giacalone, Zerilli etc that they wouldn't whack the killers to ensure nobody talked. I don't see the aforementioned group of masterminds taking any chances...not with how long they were in the game. I could be wrong, but I just have a hard time justifying why they would let the actual killers live to tell the tale.

The only problem with this is that you are going to send your best guys to hit Hoffa, right? Why kill them? What kind of message does that send to the rest of the family? In my opinion, it creates a sense of unease, wherein you follow the bosses' orders and still get killed. Sorry, doesn't make sense to me.

[rayray]

Unless they were not their best guys but someone that was capable but expendable, or someone that was near the end of their usefulness for some reason, kill two birds with one stone. No one knows for sure if the killer(s) even knew who the target was going to be until the hit was about to take place.


We'll never know what happened...it's all speculation. All of it and it always will be nothing more then what it is now.

[Snakes]

I guess my logic was you need someone dependable to kill a man like Hoffa, but if you kill him as well you lose a dependable man. Doesn't make sense to me that you'd use expendable guys for such a high-profile murder.

[JCB1977]

Would be hilarious if eventually some noboby who claims to know where Hoffa is burried actually tells the truth and they find the body.

I would have to assume at this point that the mobsters who actually know what happened to him (and I contend there is less than 3 people who actually know the deatils) are now deceased. While orders may have been given, the details of the crime are buried with whoever carried it out. The mafia isn't that good at keeping secrets, especially for 40+ years. While I believe that Provenzano, Bufalino, the Giacalone Brothers were certainly part of the crime, I have no reason to believe they were there watching the crime take place. Chucky O'Brien is the only source at this point who would have any inside information (if he knows anything).

**I certainly DO NOT BELIEVE that they transported one of the highest profile union leader across many state lines to take him and bury him in New Jersey. We know approximately where he was killed, but the burial was pre planned and not outside Michigan. Salvage yards around the Detroit area were perfect places to have him crushed into metal.

Not sure what your basing your assumption in that the people that know what happened are all dead. According to the fbi the two guys I mentioned above were there so they would know what happened and they are alive. Again according to the fbi they were just as involved as chucky

http://articles.latimes.com/1985-07-27/ ... my-hoffa/2

The masterminds behind the hit are long dead...and although Andretta and Bruglio are still alive, there hasn't been enough evidence to bring an indictment. One other reason I have a hard time believing it is because a high profile hit like Hoffa makes it hard for me to believe that the masterminds didn't "cut all ties" with the guys who did the heavy work. Personally, I don't believe that if the masterminds were people like Provenzano, Bufalino, Giacalone, Zerilli etc that they wouldn't whack the killers to ensure nobody talked. I don't see the aforementioned group of masterminds taking any chances...not with how long they were in the game. I could be wrong, but I just have a hard time justifying why they would let the actual killers live to tell the tale.

The only problem with this is that you are going to send your best guys to hit Hoffa, right? Why kill them? What kind of message does that send to the rest of the family? In my opinion, it creates a sense of unease, wherein you follow the bosses' orders and still get killed. Sorry, doesn't make sense to me.

I hear what you're saying Snakes, as I've thought the same thing for a long time. I don't believe the killers came in from out of town. I believe Zerilli or Giacaolone supplied the muscle and whacked them immediately afterwards in Northern Michigan. For a high profile hit squad to be traveling to Michigan from PA, NJ or NYC would be too easy to track for the Feds and would raise too much suspicion. Local guys took care of Hoffa. They knew the lay of the land, had contacts to dispose of the body etc.

[JCB1977]

I guess my logic was you need someone dependable to kill a man like Hoffa, but if you kill him as well you lose a dependable man. Doesn't make sense to me that you'd use expendable guys for such a high-profile murder.

Keep in mind that the mafia had an army of killers, most have killed their way up the food chain. And taking care of Hoffa to ensure Fitzy was still in charge of handing out Teamster Pension money was high on the mob's list. Hoffa was threatening to expose everybody. I know that Anthony Zerilli gave some info about Jack Tocco's property that the Feds dug up...but I truly believe that Zerilli heard the details and it isn't that crazy to keep a body on private property until it could be moved or destroyed. Anthony Zerilli knew something and although he had an axe to grind, I believe he was telling the truth in order to fuck his cousin who shelved him.