Let's talk about those Phillies

[B.]

- Tony Piccolo was probably one of the biggest local factors, who became Stanfa's consigliere and confidant. What makes this interesting is we now know Scarfo and Amuso still considered Scarfo the official Philadelphia boss until at least 2010, so we can infer Piccolo no longer recognized his cousin and willingly stepped aside for Stanfa. He was recorded expressing sadness over all the people killed in the 1980s and had been fending off Mike Ciancaglini for a couple years, so combined with the Scarfo Jr. and Fresolone case, may have just wanted some relief. Obviously he got none.

- Stanfa was recorded ranting about how Sparacio wanted Piccolo to be boss, Sparacio to be underboss, and Stanfa to be consigliere. Stanfa said where he comes from you'd get killed for trying to make those suggestions. So it doesn't seem Stana initially had any support from Sparacio to be boss.

- Goodfella Tapes says Stanfa had the backing of the Gambino and Genovese Families but I don't know the source of the info and as great as Anastasia is his books sometimes have small errors as we're all prone to make (or big ones, like the "Scarfo banishment" myth). There's also a big difference between some Gambino members (i.e. the Gambino brothers) supporting Stanfa vs. the Gambino Family oficially recognizing him. We know via DiLeonardo that John Gotti didn't recognize Stanfa or the Philly Family but I don't know if that was true from the beginning or if Gotti dropped support later. DiLeonardo has said the Corozzos continued to associate with Philadelphia despite the ruling.

- Goodfella Tapes cites Leonetti as saying Stanfa was inducted into the Philly Family though we don't know if Leonetti had specific knowledge of Stanfa's induction ceremony via Scarfo or if he was just communicating in general that Stanfa was a Philadelphia member (i.e. Leonetti didn't know whether it was a transfer or induction). A report from the 1980s says Stanfa was made in Sicily and Nino Giuffre talked about how Stanfa sponsored him for membership in the Caccamo Family and participated in the ceremony, showing they at least recognized him as one of their own.

- A big factor is also that Stanfa and his supporters were made, whereas most if not all of his enemies weren't at the time he became boss. No matter how weak Stanfa's faction was, they had membership on their side. Piccolo was recorded cautioning Stanfa not to make Ciancaglini or Merlino for that reason and his words were wise, as it legitimized their faction and the rest is history.

[Tonyd621]

Who sponsored and or who did he get made with?

[chin_gigante]

Another important piece of the puzzle is from Mafia Prince and it appears Leonetti learned all of these details from Gravano when they were in prison together:

- In Oct 1990, Piccolo was called to meet Robert Bisaccia in North Jersey
- Bisaccia told Piccolo that Gotti "and the Commission" had decided to take Scarfo down as Boss and replace him with Stanfa
- Bisaccia also told Piccolo he would be Stanfa's Consigliere

Leonetti talks about why he thinks this was done in his own words:

Those are the rules; New York always makes the Boss. The Commission. They made Ange the Boss; they made Phil Testa the Boss; and they made my uncle the Boss. So when they call Cousin Tony up and they tell him they are taking my uncle down and making John Stanfa the Boss, that’s it. My uncle might not like it, I know he didn’t like it, but there is absolutely nothing he could do about it. Those are the rules. I think Gotti was pushing Stanfa in large part so that the Philadelphia proxy vote on the Commission would swing back to the Gambinos, like it had under Ange. I think by this time, the Chin had zero interest in my uncle or the Philly mob, especially with us losing Local 54 and with Bobby Manna in jail. Not to mention I had heard from one of the agents that when we all got locked up that the Gambinos and the Genovese chopped up most of North Jersey, leaving us, Philadelphia, with practically nothing.

Later in the book, Leonetti says, "[Gravano] told me they had made John Stanfa the Boss because the siggys in the Gambino Family were pushing for him."

[Hired_Goonz]

What does he mean by "Philadelphia proxy vote" though? He makes it sound as if guys like Scarfo or Stanfa were sitting on the Commission and casting votes in the 80s and 90s. I mean I get how in the broader sense the Phily family was in the Gambino sphere of influence when Bruno was boss, then switched to the Genovese in the Scarfo era and supposedly back to the Gambinos here in the early 90s with Stanfa's ties to some Sicilian Gambino members. But I don't see where he gets "proxy vote" from that.

[Wiseguy]

What does he mean by "Philadelphia proxy vote" though? He makes it sound as if guys like Scarfo or Stanfa were sitting on the Commission and casting votes in the 80s and 90s. I mean I get how in the broader sense the Phily family was in the Gambino sphere of influence when Bruno was boss, then switched to the Genovese in the Scarfo era and supposedly back to the Gambinos here in the early 90s with Stanfa's ties to some Sicilian Gambino members. But I don't see where he gets "proxy vote" from that.

Yeah, everything in Leonetti's quote above makes sense except for the Commission thing. My understanding was Philadelphia lost their seat after Bruno was killed.

[sisterray]

I think it’s within the realm of possibility that Leonetti might’ve been made unintentionally unaware of the state of the commission by his uncle. For all we know about Scarfo, he seemed like the kind of guy that kept the cards close to his chest. The only other people that had any contact with NY were guys from North Jersey and that’s a two hour drive from Philly.

[sisterray]

I think it’s within the realm of possibility that Leonetti might’ve been made unintentionally unaware of the state of the commission by his uncle. For all we know about Scarfo, he seemed like the kind of guy that kept the cards close to his chest. The only other people that had any contact with NY were guys from North Jersey and that’s a two hour drive from Philly.

Obviously I meant to write intentionally unaware/typo

[jmack]

What does he mean by "Philadelphia proxy vote" though? He makes it sound as if guys like Scarfo or Stanfa were sitting on the Commission and casting votes in the 80s and 90s. I mean I get how in the broader sense the Phily family was in the Gambino sphere of influence when Bruno was boss, then switched to the Genovese in the Scarfo era and supposedly back to the Gambinos here in the early 90s with Stanfa's ties to some Sicilian Gambino members. But I don't see where he gets "proxy vote" from that.

Yeah, everything in Leonetti's quote above makes sense except for the Commission thing. My understanding was Philadelphia lost their seat after Bruno was killed.

Agreed. I don’t think there is any record of Testa or Scarfo attending/voting as part of the commission. My assumption is that Leonetti is using that phrase interchangeably with support for that family. “Proxy vote” meaning more cooperation in family disputes.

[ShotgunTheRifle]

I know it's been asked before. But there was a very lengthy post somewhere on here that went into depth about how Merlino/Chang took over. I searched for it all weekend. Anyone have any idea what thread it may be in.

[OcSleeper]

Could be in the article section that has been blocked off for the majority of the forum

[B.]

Yep, it does look like the Gambinos initially recognized Stanfa and then backed off. This fits what DiLeonardo said about Stanfa inducting an ex-cop, so it seems like him losing recognition had to do with his actions after becoming boss.

Leonetti's "proxy vote" comment is consistent with the history of the Commission. Families not on the Commission who were represented by an avugad still had a vote, but it was cast through their avugad and they seem to have almost always been in lock step, with the subordinate Family's "vote" being little more than a formality. It's similar in this way to boss and consigliere elections where the captain meets with his soldiers and they form a concensus (almost always in agreement with the captain's opinion) and the crew votes as a block via the captain. The Commission traditionally worked the same way.