General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

[PolackTony]

That's why I wonder if it was in context with a dispute. If a made member has to sit down for someone, he is acting as the representative / lawyer and "avvocato" is used in Italy to mean lawyer.

Campise being a member of their crew makes it weird, as even if Campise was serving as "avugad" in a dispute it would mean Prio likely approved or at least knew it. Not something DiBella would need to share like gossip with Prio, and then Prio trades gossip about someone else being avugad. I know Campise was ID'd as a member under Solano but is he confirmed to have always formally reported to that crew?

I don't interpret it to be like a captain -- the impression I have going through all these Chicago files is that made members' role as "lieutenants" to their capodecina was much more apparent. That's true for other cities too though -- I've been trying to argue for years that "soldier" is one of the misleading terms for a made member, as becoming made makes you a boss / lieutenant over associates and various interests. Not all made members / lieutenants are created equal either. There were so many members in NYC that this was probably less apparent, but in a city with a smaller membership it would be obvious that made members were not "soldiers" but lieutenants in their own right.

Plays into what CC was saying about Toledo the other night -- people have assumed Detroit's member there was a captain because he represented their interests, but the evidence is he didn't have rank. As a made member though he was no doubt a "lieutenant" repping Detroit's Toledo interests.



- This one confused me, as I thought it was saying Prio was "made" along with 20-30 members around the same time, but it's just saying Prio is "made" and the informant estimates 20-30 made members in Chicago. No doubt they had more but interesting they had a very conservative view of the size.

Yeah, it could just mean that the individuals referred to were members. A couple of sources stated that made guys were called "mustaches", which makes sense in that "mustache" may have been a reference to the old Sicilian mafiosi, with connotations of seniority and authority. Maybe associates called them "mustaches" but then within the family, they were thought of as avugad. The way I've seen it is that most made guys (with some apparent exceptions like Nick Calabrese) were lieutenants of their capos and functioned as "crew bosses" over their associate networks. So thinking of these guys as "avvocati" with respect to the mafia organization as a system of representation would make sense. Maybe Campise was a member (do we know when he was made?) but perhaps not yet under the Prio crew, so Dibella and Prio were gossiping about made guys who weren't reporting to them and who they thus might not necessarily have been aware were members. I dunno. CI sources in this era don't seem to really identify Campise as a player with the Northside crew (he's not one of the names that are always listed yet), so maybe he was either not made yet or actually belonged to a different crew initially. The report does identify him as a Westside guy operating in West Humboldt Park (Cerone/Battaglia territory), though of course, that isn't always diagnostic of actual crew affiliation.

[Antiliar]

I'm not sure that Campise was a member of his crew. He could have been a member of the Battaglia (West Side) crew operating in the Near North Side. He would have been one of several such as Butch Loverde, Sam Louis, Hunk Galiano, and Phil Alderisio. Decades later we see Red Wemette, an associate of the Grand Avenue crew (the successor to the Battaglia crew), operating there.

So if Campise was actually a Battaglia guy (he could have switched crews later) at that time, then he could have been an avugad in a dispute between the two crews.

[PolackTony]

I'm not sure that Campise was a member of his crew. He could have been a member of the Battaglia (West Side) crew operating in the Near North Side. He would have been one of several such as Butch Loverde, Sam Louis, Hunk Galiano, and Phil Alderisio. Decades later we see Red Wemette, an associate of the Grand Avenue crew (the successor to the Battaglia crew), operating there.

So if Campise was actually a Battaglia guy (he could have switched crews later) at that time, then he could have been an avugad in a dispute between the two crews.

Yeah, that's a good take. Caifano was another guy that was a Westside guy who some ofthese CIs identified along with actual Northside crew members, based on the fact that he was active in the Near Northside. Lenny Gianola and Obie Frabotta were also Westside guys who had operations in Northside territory.

If avugad just was designating a guy representing a party in a dispute, it's hard to make sense of DiBella's "he's got a good crowd" comment and further noting that they had a party at McCormick Place. Sounds like a crew to me (though presumably of associates).

[Snakes]

That's why I wonder if it was in context with a dispute. If a made member has to sit down for someone, he is acting as the representative / lawyer and "avvocato" is used in Italy to mean lawyer.

Campise being a member of their crew makes it weird, as even if Campise was serving as "avugad" in a dispute it would mean Prio likely approved or at least knew it. Not something DiBella would need to share like gossip with Prio, and then Prio trades gossip about someone else being avugad. I know Campise was ID'd as a member under Solano but is he confirmed to have always formally reported to that crew?

I don't interpret it to be like a captain -- the impression I have going through all these Chicago files is that made members' role as "lieutenants" to their capodecina was much more apparent. That's true for other cities too though -- I've been trying to argue for years that "soldier" is one of the misleading terms for a made member, as becoming made makes you a boss / lieutenant over associates and various interests. Not all made members / lieutenants are created equal either. There were so many members in NYC that this was probably less apparent, but in a city with a smaller membership it would be obvious that made members were not "soldiers" but lieutenants in their own right.

Plays into what CC was saying about Toledo the other night -- people have assumed Detroit's member there was a captain because he represented their interests, but the evidence is he didn't have rank. As a made member though he was no doubt a "lieutenant" repping Detroit's Toledo interests.



- This one confused me, as I thought it was saying Prio was "made" along with 20-30 members around the same time, but it's just saying Prio is "made" and the informant estimates 20-30 made members in Chicago. No doubt they had more but interesting they had a very conservative view of the size.

Yeah, it could just mean that the individuals referred to were members. A couple of sources stated that made guys were called "mustaches", which makes sense in that "mustache" may have been a reference to the old Sicilian mafiosi, with connotations of seniority and authority. Maybe associates called them "mustaches" but then within the family, they were thought of as avugad. The way I've seen it is that most made guys (with some apparent exceptions like Nick Calabrese) were lieutenants of their capos and functioned as "crew bosses" over their associate networks. So thinking of these guys as "avvocati" with respect to the mafia organization as a system of representation would make sense. Maybe Campise was a member (do we know when he was made?) but perhaps not yet under the Prio crew, so Dibella and Prio were gossiping about made guys who weren't reporting to them and who they thus might not necessarily have been aware were members. I dunno. CI sources in this era don't seem to really identify Campise as a player with the Northside crew (he's not one of the names that are always listed yet), so maybe he was either not made yet or actually belonged to a different crew initially. The report does identify him as a Westside guy operating in West Humboldt Park (Cerone/Battaglia territory), though of course, that isn't always diagnostic of actual crew affiliation.

What you said is very similar to some intel shared in the 1990s. "Made" members were responsible to a capo but some of them had their own crew of members and/or associates. I'm sure this was even more accurate in the 60s considering the size of the organization compared to the 90s. I've also heard informants describe members who bossed a specific police district.

Ken Eto also described a group of "crew bosses" operating underneath the capos. Some of the guys underneath the "crew bosses" were made:

Capo: Vincent Solano
Crew Bosses: Jasper Campise, Joseph DiVarco, August Giovenco, Michael Glitta
Crew Members: Joseph Arnold, Victor Arrigo, Orlando Catanese, Anthony Cirignani, Frank DeMonte, Peter Dunias, Ken Eto, Ronald Ignoffo, John Matassa, Frank Orlando, Frank Tornabene

[B.]

Appreciate you guys letting me riff about Chicago a bit. You're the avugads.



- Some compaesano who said Prio sought his family out early on in the US because of coming from Ciminna. Likely just a social relationship (another version of the same report mentions Prio contacted both the source and his mother), but plays into Prio being partners with his Ciminna paesan Oneglia. Definitely seems Prio was forming relationships (social and otherwise) based on his hometown.

-

Also this unredacted version of the "governing board" report clears up my speculation about the informant making a distinction between the "board" and crews. I was wrong and he's simply referring to membership of the Prio crew as a "governing board". Still worth noting he put the number at 10 and seems to refer to made members:



-

When asked, Caifano acknowledged the existence of the "syndicate" and his membership in it, which he said had a hierarchy, and broke it down in the context of gambling but refused to ID the hierarchy or anyone else. Definitely had the makings of a CI even if he didn't become one:

[B.]

What you said is very similar to some intel shared in the 1990s. "Made" members were responsible to a capo but some of them had their own crew of members and/or associates. I'm sure this was even more accurate in the 60s considering the size of the organization compared to the 90s. I've also heard informants describe members who bossed a specific police district.

Ken Eto also described a group of "crew bosses" operating underneath the capos. Some of the guys underneath the "crew bosses" were made:

Capo: Vincent Solano
Crew Bosses: Jasper Campise, Joseph DiVarco, August Giovenco, Michael Glitta
Crew Members: Joseph Arnold, Victor Arrigo, Orlando Catanese, Anthony Cirignani, Frank DeMonte, Peter Dunias, Ken Eto, Ronald Ignoffo, John Matassa, Frank Orlando, Frank Tornabene

Maybe the "avugad" role discussed by Prio/DiBella is a way of understanding these relationships?

Certain members may have been designated "avugad" for the sake of representation. Jasper Campise being ID'd as an "avugad" and Eto calling him a "crew boss" might not be a coincidence.

Like Joe Bonanno said about the name of the organization itself, there is an eye of the beholder aspect of this stuff that informs how they talk about it. One guy might see them as "crew boss" from his POV, while older Sicilian members like Prio/DiBella may have seen it as "avugad". Doesn't change the function but we're talking about people from a different generation/position/lineage.

[Antiliar]

When asked, Caifano acknowledged the existence of the "syndicate" and his membership in it, which he said had a hierarchy, and broke it down in the context of gambling but refused to ID the hierarchy or anyone else. Definitely had the makings of a CI even if he didn't become one:

I wouldn't put too much credence into Caifano's statement. At different times Accardo and Solly D said that the Outfit is a syndicate of gamblers. It's a dodge to avoid giving honest answers.

[PolackTony]

When asked, Caifano acknowledged the existence of the "syndicate" and his membership in it, which he said had a hierarchy, and broke it down in the context of gambling but refused to ID the hierarchy or anyone else. Definitely had the makings of a CI even if he didn't become one:

I wouldn't put too much credence into Caifano's statement. At different times Accardo and Solly D said that the Outfit is a syndicate of gamblers. It's a dodge to avoid giving honest answers.

“It’s an outfit of guys who like to gamble. If they were any other kinda businessman, they’d be in the Chamber of Commerce.

[PolackTony]

What you said is very similar to some intel shared in the 1990s. "Made" members were responsible to a capo but some of them had their own crew of members and/or associates. I'm sure this was even more accurate in the 60s considering the size of the organization compared to the 90s. I've also heard informants describe members who bossed a specific police district.

Ken Eto also described a group of "crew bosses" operating underneath the capos. Some of the guys underneath the "crew bosses" were made:

Capo: Vincent Solano
Crew Bosses: Jasper Campise, Joseph DiVarco, August Giovenco, Michael Glitta
Crew Members: Joseph Arnold, Victor Arrigo, Orlando Catanese, Anthony Cirignani, Frank DeMonte, Peter Dunias, Ken Eto, Ronald Ignoffo, John Matassa, Frank Orlando, Frank Tornabene

Maybe the "avugad" role discussed by Prio/DiBella is a way of understanding these relationships?

Certain members may have been designated "avugad" for the sake of representation. Jasper Campise being ID'd as an "avugad" and Eto calling him a "crew boss" might not be a coincidence.

Like Joe Bonanno said about the name of the organization itself, there is an eye of the beholder aspect of this stuff that informs how they talk about it. One guy might see them as "crew boss" from his POV, while older Sicilian members like Prio/DiBella may have seen it as "avugad". Doesn't change the function but we're talking about people from a different generation/position/lineage.

I’m glad that Snakes brought up the Eto testimony, as it’s important. While Eto obviously wasn’t a member, he was an important and longtime associate and I believe that his hierarchy is accurate. It also fits with the picture we get of Frank Calabrese as a “crew boss” responsible for not only associates but Nick as well. They may have referred to these guys as avugad, crew boss, or lieutenant, same as how they may refer to a capo as a capodecina, street boss, or captain. This likely depended on both context (formal mafia affairs) as well as background of the member, as B suggests. Worth noting that in the three cases that we’ve seen these formal terms like capodecina and avvocato used thus far, all the parties involved in the conversation were Sicilians. Not to say that the mainland ancestry members didn’t use them, of course, but still worth noting.

Also worth noting that the number of made guys on Eto’s chart was probably right around 10.

[PolackTony]

I also believe that Pranno was probably a “crew boss” for Battaglia and that Spilotro and maybe Eboli the same under Lombardo.

[B.]

No doubt Caifano was deliberately playing it off as a gambling organization. Still interesting he admitted "membership" and acknowledged a "hierarchy". Not much value to what he said detail-wise beyond describing the gambling structure.

This likely depended on both context (formal mafia affairs) as well as background of the member, as B suggests.

Brings to mind what Felice shared about John Gambino taking offense when Gotti called the capodecina position "skipper". Not that anyone in Chicago would be upset about someone else's terminology, but we do see a preference for the way things are phrased depending on who it is. Joe Bonanno was extremely opinionated about terminology even though he admitted they were describing the same basic things -- he did feel it reflects poorly/incorrectly on the function when different phrases are used, though.

[B.]

I think it's wrong to assume Chicago was all of one mind about this stuff, too. Phil Bacino might feel differently about the formal organization than Frank Ferraro even though their families come from the same small area of Agrigento. Frank Calabrese might have felt differently from Sam Giancana for that matter even though their ranks/era/heritage would lead you to make assumptions about one opposed to the other.

"Chicago feels differently about the formalities" is a huge generalization, as is "Chicago had a formal mafia Family therefore the entire Family thought about things the same way Rockford did". One man's avugad is another man's crew boss and they might agree on who held the role but hard to say they were 100% philosophically aligned even in the same Family.

If you asked Charlie Carneglia about the Gambino Family you're going to get a different POV than if you asked Joe Arcuri. It's one of the pitfalls even when we have solid info -- even with member CIs, we're hostage to their POV.

[Antiliar]

I think it's wrong to assume Chicago was all of one mind about this stuff, too. Phil Bacino might feel differently about the formal organization than Frank Ferraro even though their families come from the same small area of Agrigento. Frank Calabrese might have felt differently from Sam Giancana for that matter even though their ranks/era/heritage would lead you to make assumptions about one opposed to the other.

"Chicago feels differently about the formalities" is a huge generalization, as is "Chicago had a formal mafia Family therefore the entire Family thought about things the same way Rockford did". One man's avugad is another man's crew boss and they might agree on who held the role but hard to say they were 100% philosophically aligned even in the same Family.

If you asked Charlie Carneglia about the Gambino Family you're going to get a different POV than if you asked Joe Arcuri. It's one of the pitfalls even when we have solid info -- even with member CIs, we're hostage to their POV.

If we we're to generalize, I would guess that those with strong roots and connections to Sicily would be more likely to have stronger feelings about formalities than American-born with few roots or connections to Italy (I'm contrasting Sicily to Italy in general).

[cavita]

I think it's wrong to assume Chicago was all of one mind about this stuff, too. Phil Bacino might feel differently about the formal organization than Frank Ferraro even though their families come from the same small area of Agrigento. Frank Calabrese might have felt differently from Sam Giancana for that matter even though their ranks/era/heritage would lead you to make assumptions about one opposed to the other.

"Chicago feels differently about the formalities" is a huge generalization, as is "Chicago had a formal mafia Family therefore the entire Family thought about things the same way Rockford did". One man's avugad is another man's crew boss and they might agree on who held the role but hard to say they were 100% philosophically aligned even in the same Family.

If you asked Charlie Carneglia about the Gambino Family you're going to get a different POV than if you asked Joe Arcuri. It's one of the pitfalls even when we have solid info -- even with member CIs, we're hostage to their POV.

If we we're to generalize, I would guess that those with strong roots and connections to Sicily would be more likely to have stronger feelings about formalities than American-born with few roots or connections to Italy (I'm contrasting Sicily to Italy in general).

Don't know what made me think of this but in FBI files from the 1960s it was noted that some of the Rockford members distrusted underboss Frank Buscemi- not because he was born in Sicily (the three noted members were American-born Sicilians) but because he had recently moved to Rockford from Chicago. Here they were working under one large entity, the Mafia, and Buscemi was distrusted because of geography and it wasn't from a certain town in Sicily.

[Coloboy]

What you said is very similar to some intel shared in the 1990s. "Made" members were responsible to a capo but some of them had their own crew of members and/or associates. I'm sure this was even more accurate in the 60s considering the size of the organization compared to the 90s. I've also heard informants describe members who bossed a specific police district.

Ken Eto also described a group of "crew bosses" operating underneath the capos. Some of the guys underneath the "crew bosses" were made:

Capo: Vincent Solano
Crew Bosses: Jasper Campise, Joseph DiVarco, August Giovenco, Michael Glitta
Crew Members: Joseph Arnold, Victor Arrigo, Orlando Catanese, Anthony Cirignani, Frank DeMonte, Peter Dunias, Ken Eto, Ronald Ignoffo, John Matassa, Frank Orlando, Frank Tornabene

Maybe the "avugad" role discussed by Prio/DiBella is a way of understanding these relationships?

Certain members may have been designated "avugad" for the sake of representation. Jasper Campise being ID'd as an "avugad" and Eto calling him a "crew boss" might not be a coincidence.

Like Joe Bonanno said about the name of the organization itself, there is an eye of the beholder aspect of this stuff that informs how they talk about it. One guy might see them as "crew boss" from his POV, while older Sicilian members like Prio/DiBella may have seen it as "avugad". Doesn't change the function but we're talking about people from a different generation/position/lineage.

I’m glad that Snakes brought up the Eto testimony, as it’s important. While Eto obviously wasn’t a member, he was an important and longtime associate and I believe that his hierarchy is accurate. It also fits with the picture we get of Frank Calabrese as a “crew boss” responsible for not only associates but Nick as well. They may have referred to these guys as avugad, crew boss, or lieutenant, same as how they may refer to a capo as a capodecina, street boss, or captain. This likely depended on both context (formal mafia affairs) as well as background of the member, as B suggests. Worth noting that in the three cases that we’ve seen these formal terms like capodecina and avvocato used thus far, all the parties involved in the conversation were Sicilians. Not to say that the mainland ancestry members didn’t use them, of course, but still worth noting.

Also worth noting that the number of made guys on Eto’s chart was probably right around 10.

Eto's testimony is an interesting study. One thing that always confused me was that by time he gave it (83 or 84), both Carlisi and Difronzo were firmly entrenched as either Capos or "territorial bosses". However, he does not mention either of them. A few short years later they would be named the #1 and #2 over the whole outfit. The same issue comes up with the Last Supper picture in 76. No Carlisi, no Difronzo. I've always seen it surmised that it may have been because Cicero was represented at the meeting by Aiuppa, and EP by Cerone. One thought I had is maybe that last supper photo in 76 was the official "board of directors", and although both Carlisi and Difronzo were capos, perhaps they weren't members of the board yet?