John & Gene Show / "2 Mob Bosses Sitdown" -- Paul Tanso

[chin_gigante]

In Mob Talk Sitdown 9 (which has unfortunately been taken down from the YouTube channel), Anastasia says Luisi told him that he (Luisi) and Borgesi went up to Boston to make 6 or 7 guys.

Taking into account Luisi's comments on the Johnny & Gene Show that there were a few Boston ceremonies, the two members Caprio was asked to get permission for could have just been the first of those ceremonies.

[Angelo Santino]

Did Luisi tell the FBI that there were 6-7 guys? I mean given the rarity or importance of membership, Luisi would know if it was 6 or 7 specifically. On his own (as per this show), I wouldn't believe a thing he says without other sources. I got nothing more to add.

Thank you for posting all of these!

[dack2001]

CC, I don't get your point here about Luisi...however I get your point overall about needing reliable evidence. Are you saying it's not enough evidence to edit your list? Well, than I'll say your list is going to be pretty damn inaccurate.

It also seems a stupid post to die on when you've got Luisi and Tanso saying it in a interview, which jibes with what was reported that 6 or 7 guys got down, which jibes with Carpio's remarks in 1998ish, which jibes with Vetere's rep and the people he associates with post-prison, which jibes with what Previte said in his book that Merlino ordered those guys to work with him and consider him a made guy like them guys who got made in Boston, which jobes with what some have posted here.

[chin_gigante]

Did Luisi tell the FBI that there were 6-7 guys? I mean given the rarity or importance of membership, Luisi would know if it was 6 or 7 specifically. On his own (as per this show), I wouldn't believe a thing he says without other sources. I got nothing more to add.

Thank you for posting all of these!

Obviously it's tough to describe because the footage from the Mob Talk is no longer available, but my impression from it was that Anastasia was just pulling the "6 or 7" from his recollection rather than that being verbatim what Luisi told him. Anastasia also said this was in 1997 or 1998 when these guys got straightened out, but in reality Luisi didn't get introduced to the Philly guys until 1998 so it couldn't be '97. So my impression was it was just Anastasia making a rough statement about something Luisi had told him

[Angelo Santino]

So there could have 3 guys only that were made-Luisi, Vetere and Gentile.

[chin_gigante]

Looks like Luisi has made the claim about wanting to form his own family before:

Philly Voice
23 August 2016
George Anastasia
'Former Joey Merlino mob associate Robert "Boston Bob" Luisi now a Christian minister'
https://www.phillyvoice.com/former-joey ... -minister/

Previte, in a phone interview on Monday, said he never disliked Luisi but thought he was too easily manipulated by Merlino and Borgesi.

“I didn’t dislike him, but I thought he was foolish and being used by them,” the onetime wiseguy said.

Luisi didn’t see it that way. He said he sought out the Philadelphia mob in the 1990s because of conflicts he was having with the Boston-based mob family with which he was associated.

At first, he said, he tried to align with the Gambino crime family in New York. But he said Peter Gotti, who was running the family for his jailed brother John at the time, said, “We don’t need any more friends.”

Luisi said he then used an associate who had spent time in jail with Philadelphia mob leader Ralph Natale to arrange a meeting in Philadelphia. Luisi said he first met with Natale at The Pub, a popular bar-restaurant in Pennsauken. He subsequently met with Borgesi and a crew of mob associates at a dinner in Delaware County and then met with Merlino at Gino’s Café, a South Philadelphia corner bar that the mob controlled at the time.

Those meetings led to an affiliation and Luisi’s formal initiation into the Philadelphia crime family. He became a capo with his own crew in Boston. By his estimation, he was generating tens of thousands of dollars a month through gambling, loansharking and drug dealing.

“When I went to jail, I had a million dollars on the street,” Luisi said of the various mob gambits in which he was involved. The feds would later allege that Luisi was sending $10,000 a month to Merlino as tribute and that, in effect, he bought his way into the organization.

“With Joey it was always pride and ego and money,” Luisi said.

Luisi said his goal at the time was to develop his own organization and eventually split off from Philadelphia. But sometime in 1998 he said, “I had an awakening.”

[chin_gigante]

Found some more stuff:

Boston Globe
27 July 2016
Stephen Kurkjian and Shelley Murphy
'A tale of Buried masterpieces'
https://epaper.bostonglobe.com/BostonGl ... ource=next

Luisi said his bid to become a “made man’’ in the New England Mafia was blocked by a capo. In a rare and bold move, Luisi asked to join the Philadelphia family, which made him a capo in 1998 and let him operate his cocaine trafficking business out of Boston in exchange for tribute.

Luisi’s goal was to create his own family in Boston, with [Robert] Guarente as his underboss and Gentile as his consigliere.

Jersey Man
11 January 2018
George Anastasia
'Not Even Ten Cents on the Dollar'
https://jerseymanmagazine.com/not-even- ... he-dollar/

The Philadelphia connection surfaced much later and was built around a group of Boston wiseguys and wannabes affiliated with Bobby Luisi who in the mid 1990s forged an alliance with Merlino and company in what Luisi said was an initial step toward forming his own crime family.

“We were in a war up there,” Luisi explained in a recent telephone conversation from his home outside of Nashville where, reborn as the Reverend Alonso Esposito, the former mobster is now a born-again preacher with his own television ministry (but that’s a story for another day). “I only hooked up with Joey to get made and to make my own crew.”

Luisi said he and George Borgesi, a top Merlino lieutenant, traveled to Boston in 1997 and formally initiated a half dozen of Luisi’s associates into the Philadelphia mob. One of those initiates was Robert “The Cook” Gentile.

Luisi’s plans to start his own family were short circuited by the FBI. He was caught up in a sting operation and indicted for drug dealing. Merlino and company faced racketeering charges in Philadelphia. The organization literally came undone.

[Wiseguy]

Do we know who the twelve soldiers Arilotta had in his crew were? I never realized that crew was so big. It seems strange that they went from twelve made members, with hundreds of associates, to only one or two made members in such a short time.

Hundreds of associates is likely an exaggeration. At least it would be an extremely loose definition of associate.

As far as members in Massachusetts and Connecticut, if we're talking very early 2000's before Bruno was killed in 2003, off the top of my head there was...

Anthony Arilotta
Al Bruno
Anthony Delevo
Emilio Fusco
Felix Tranghese
Carlo Mastrototaro
Anthony Volpe
Albert Scibelli

[Angelo Santino]

CC, I don't get your point here about Luisi...however I get your point overall about needing reliable evidence. Are you saying it's not enough evidence to edit your list? Well, than I'll say your list is going to be pretty damn inaccurate.

It also seems a stupid post to die on when you've got Luisi and Tanso saying it in a interview, which jibes with what was reported that 6 or 7 guys got down, which jibes with Carpio's remarks in 1998ish, which jibes with Vetere's rep and the people he associates with post-prison, which jibes with what Previte said in his book that Merlino ordered those guys to work with him and consider him a made guy like them guys who got made in Boston, which jobes with what some have posted here.

Um, what? I don't know what list you're referring to. I'm not dying on any hill.

I'm referring to sources external to Luisi who made it into the Federal case that cite only two made members, not the "6 or 7" that Luisi told Anastasia afterward. Phila. barely made 6 or 7 guys during Natale's reign in their own city yet they're going to make 6-7 people they barely know in NE? This deserves scrutiny.

What source beyond Luisi (and by extension Anastasia whom Luisi confided the info) maintains that 6-7 members were made? The guy flipped and he was debriefed by the FBI, which is when LCNers are usually at their most honest point of their life. Take Natale- he told the FBI that Merlino made him, 20 years later he tells VladTV that Gambino/Bruno made him in a joint ceremony. He's not the only one to lie, just the most extreme.

I'm pretty sure Luisi was asked basic questions in his debriefing, what answers he provided them there I'd likely go with. I'm sure they asked him the amount of members he made. If he told them 6 or 7 then that settles it.

[chin_gigante]

I talked to TJ about the info he and Stroccos got from Luisi on the other Boston guys. He gave me permission to post what was said:

- Paul Pepicelli and Robert Gentile were made first (though TJ was not sure about Gentile's placement in the ceremonies), then Robert Puleo, Paul Tanso and David Pepicelli, then finally Shawn Vetere
- Luisi originally didn't want to name relatives and guys who didn't get pinched (the Pepicellis, Tanso, Puleo) as made but did so later

[dack2001]

CC---Of course wiseguys lie, especially rats. Natale's whole book is a joke. I also appreciate finding at least two sources of information whenever possible if your are researching OC. On this particular issue with the Boston guys, I felt your skepticism wasn't warranted because there was ample evidence that more 6-7 guys had been made by Philly and the names were out there. But its all good man, no offense intended. I just think in order to make lists accurate, you can't just rely on the FBI.

[chin_gigante]

Michael McGowan appears to buy the story that Luisi wanted to start his own family. From McGowan's 2018 book Ghost:

20201016_135941.jpg

[Angelo Santino]

CC---Of course wiseguys lie, especially rats. Natale's whole book is a joke. I also appreciate finding at least two sources of information whenever possible if your are researching OC. On this particular issue with the Boston guys, I felt your skepticism wasn't warranted because there was ample evidence that more 6-7 guys had been made by Philly and the names were out there. But its all good man, no offense intended. I just think in order to make lists accurate, you can't just rely on the FBI.

What ample evidence? So far I've seen Luisi himself and Anastasia parroting Luisi, and the subsequent news articles quoting them. That's an example of multiple streams coming from one source, not separate sources. Did Natale say 6-7? Did Previte confirm that? FBI debriefing? I'm not trying to fit things to my own narrative, believe me I don't need for there to be or not be whatever there was/wasn't in Boston. But after watching this episode, I found this claim suspicious and simply asked what sources do we have for Boston.

[JakeTheSnake630]

Does anyone know what Luisi's falling out with his family was over? His father, brother and cousin.

[Rocco]

Arliotta has made clear in both his interviews with Gene and John that was an “area boss” and not boss of a family or anything. He doesn’t seem to exaggerate as much as these other guys. But I do find it hysterical from watching both of Arilotta’s interviews with these guys that he has no sort of remorse for being a criminal, he’s just remorseful he got mixed up with wise guys. I think he truly believes he’d have never got jammed up for any of his criminal activities if he never associated with mob guys.

I got that from Arliotta as well. I think he is the most truthful as well. Alite murdered and baseball batted every walking male in the North East lol Its too much. How do they not see that.

The only thing I’ll say in Alite’s defense is like half the guests they’ve had on their show have talked about him like he was the fucking Incredible Hulk. And while Gene’s obsession with Franzese is getting annoying, the kid Hootie said Gene was being recruited by crews with the Genovese and Gambino Family before he got with Ronnie G. These guys were both in the life and involved with top guys, just feels like sometimes they are putting a little too much mustard on their hot dog.

Maybe I’m wrong but the guys that go out of their way to say what a bad guy Alite was aren’t really know tough guys from what I’ve seen.

Watch the Andrew DiDonato interview, he is respectful but doesn’t pay Alite any special deference at all. Alite makes it a point to say Andrew and his friend Mikey Y were real tough guys. Alite was capable and DiDonato was capable, that’s about as far as it goes when both guys are certified shooters.

Did DiDonato and Alite actually know each other? Same crime family ? I think Mikey Y was pretty well known to the Gottis. Maybe that's why there is no bull shitting flying around. They both know whats up ! I still don't know how Alite knew and did biz with Arilotta ? What was the connection there?