Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 9:49 am
Three made guys with a few guys underneath each of them, whats so hard to believe about that?
No, I dont know anything about the present day mob... do you? I know you believe whatever law enforcement says and if someone has not been arrested before then the mob must not exsist. Call me what you want, but your argument is as subjective as mine. I believe cleveland is as dead as a door nail and the same with some other cities so I just dont believe every mid western mob family is thriving. But to say you cant have three crews because lack of indictments is the most tired, apathetic thesis out there. I worked in government (military to be exact) and I hate to tell you but they dont know everything that everybody is doing all the time. People get away with shit just as often as they are caught. And sometimes its 10,15 years or more before somebody gets pinched.
First, indictments - especially over the long term - have proven to be one the best ways to guage the state of a family. What, do you think it's a coincidence there are the most indictments in New York, less in Philadelphia, and none in Denver? You may be tired of hearing about indictments because they rain on your parade but that's your problem.
Second, how are looking at what law enforcement and mob experts say, as well as indictments, "as subjective" as your argument? You're pulling theoretical numbers, based on literally nothing, out of thin air and actually trying to use them in this argument. Where did 3 crews come from except your ass? You're just going on wishful thinking. Period.
Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 1:38 pm
Three made guys each having 3-4 guys underneath running schemes, scores, etc. Im not saying the guys underneath are all made guys with roots traced back etc etc. Im saying these associates could be non italian polish, irish, felons met in prison at a bar etc, loaning money at high interest, stolen property, drugs, gambling, laundering etc. Im not implying there is a hierachy of a boss, underboss, consig...but they can build something of a structured more modest, watered down generic version of what they saw growing up without interruption, absolutley I believe that
Yeah, that's "Possible". So what? 3 left over made guys having a few associates under them doing something independently are called "Remnants" from a defunct Family. That's what we have said now about 10 times. That aside, Cleveland will "never" be a functioning Family unless we can all climb into a time machine & go back to America the way it was 40 to 45 years ago.
I never said cleveland was functioning. I believe clev is as dead as you say it is. But KC, the made guys all know each other, hang out at the same places. You can label it on how you want, well actually you will wait till the fbi labels it and you can call it whatever they say it is. Because your view is the Gs view. I have my own opinion. And the FBI acknowledged at least vince civella, ribaste, frank deluna, Cammissano, simone (two of them i believe-joe, and pete) all made guys. So there is 6 made guys right there.
The gambling bust involving William Cammisano Jr. was basically a scenario where a made member of the family was running a bookmaking operation with a handful of associates under him. But that's not the same thing as an actual crew; for a family to be viable and have three crews they would need an administration and three captains. It's not so hard to believe that the few members left are involved to some degree in loansharking, gambling, etc.
"A thug changes, and love changes, and best friends become strangers. Word up."
There is at least 6 made guys in kc still. And according to scott b at the funeral in march of joey ragusa, five made guys were noted as pallbearers.
"Sciortino, alleged underboss Peter (Las Vegas Pete) Simone, respected advisor Frank DeLuna and reputed capos Joseph (Joe Pete) Simone and William (Little Willie) Cammisano."
So they dont operate "independently" one would assume all hanging out at jaspers, gilhoolys etc...
aleksandrored wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 7:47 am
In a few years we will have informants saying that the Boss of Kansas is the Boss of Bosses who dominates the five families in the shadows.
Hahahaha only you would believe that... 3 crews is possible... but what your saying here is stupid beyond belief.
Lol obviously he was joking. Listen maybe there is alittle action going on now with a few made guys. Now I dont know off hand how old these made guys are, but what happens if they are busted, then you have nobody made left on the streets, an administration over some associates and more time wasted on rebuilding.
aleksandrored wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 7:47 am
In a few years we will have informants saying that the Boss of Kansas is the Boss of Bosses who dominates the five families in the shadows.
Hahahaha only you would believe that... 3 crews is possible... but what your saying here is stupid beyond belief.
Lol obviously he was joking. Listen maybe there is alittle action going on now with a few made guys. Now I dont know off hand how old these made guys are, but what happens if they are busted, then you have nobody made left on the streets, an administration over some associates and more time wasted on rebuilding.
From what I can find online about bust in 2010, it involved 10 guys, pretty old then, most would be in there 70s now probably.
Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 4:18 pm
There is at least 6 made guys in kc still. And according to scott b at the funeral in march of joey ragusa, five made guys were noted as pallbearers.
"Sciortino, alleged underboss Peter (Las Vegas Pete) Simone, respected advisor Frank DeLuna and reputed capos Joseph (Joe Pete) Simone and William (Little Willie) Cammisano."
So they dont operate "independently" one would assume all hanging out at jaspers, gilhoolys etc...
Scott B. would have you believe there are 20 active Families in America so he can sell more books.
The overall information on this Forum is much better & more honest even if there are disagreements.
Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 4:18 pm
There is at least 6 made guys in kc still. And according to scott b at the funeral in march of joey ragusa, five made guys were noted as pallbearers.
"Sciortino, alleged underboss Peter (Las Vegas Pete) Simone, respected advisor Frank DeLuna and reputed capos Joseph (Joe Pete) Simone and William (Little Willie) Cammisano."
So they dont operate "independently" one would assume all hanging out at jaspers, gilhoolys etc...
Scott B. would have you believe there are 20 active Families in America so he can sell more books.
The overall information on this Forum is much better & more honest even if there are disagreements.
Scott B was reporting what he saw or what LE sources based out of missouri saw. He didnt make it up.
Dont get upset with me bc it wasnt on an fbi memo to prove 100% accuracy.
I heard all the great grandsons of the original members of the Madison family have started things up again and because of their bloodlines they have to be recognized by the other LCN families in the U.S. This has been common mafia protocol for years if a defunct family wants to start up again. This is huge news among the Badger State's underworld and the FBI has just gotten word of this. Watch the news, both local and national and all this will be exposed soon.
Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 4:18 pm
There is at least 6 made guys in kc still. And according to scott b at the funeral in march of joey ragusa, five made guys were noted as pallbearers.
"Sciortino, alleged underboss Peter (Las Vegas Pete) Simone, respected advisor Frank DeLuna and reputed capos Joseph (Joe Pete) Simone and William (Little Willie) Cammisano."
So they dont operate "independently" one would assume all hanging out at jaspers, gilhoolys etc...
Scott B. would have you believe there are 20 active Families in America so he can sell more books.
The overall information on this Forum is much better & more honest even if there are disagreements.
There's still at least 7 members of Kansas City but, aside from that paltry figure, you can't read too much into titles at this point with a place like KC. They're relatively meaningless.
cavita wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:22 pm
I heard all the great grandsons of the original members of the Madison family have started things up again and because of their bloodlines they have to be recognized by the other LCN families in the U.S. This has been common mafia protocol for years if a defunct family wants to start up again. This is huge news among the Badger State's underworld and the FBI has just gotten word of this. Watch the news, both local and national and all this will be exposed soon.
Grande Grande Grande stuff man. Very informative paragraph. Im going to buy a national tv bundle so I can get the ohio news!
Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 4:18 pm
There is at least 6 made guys in kc still. And according to scott b at the funeral in march of joey ragusa, five made guys were noted as pallbearers.
"Sciortino, alleged underboss Peter (Las Vegas Pete) Simone, respected advisor Frank DeLuna and reputed capos Joseph (Joe Pete) Simone and William (Little Willie) Cammisano."
So they dont operate "independently" one would assume all hanging out at jaspers, gilhoolys etc...
Scott B. would have you believe there are 20 active Families in America so he can sell more books.
The overall information on this Forum is much better & more honest even if there are disagreements.
Scott B was reporting what he saw or what LE sources based out of missouri saw. He didnt make it up.
Dont get upset with me bc it wasnt on an fbi memo to prove 100% accuracy.
What ScottB says LE says and what LE actually says are often two very different things.
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 4:18 pm
There is at least 6 made guys in kc still. And according to scott b at the funeral in march of joey ragusa, five made guys were noted as pallbearers.
"Sciortino, alleged underboss Peter (Las Vegas Pete) Simone, respected advisor Frank DeLuna and reputed capos Joseph (Joe Pete) Simone and William (Little Willie) Cammisano."
So they dont operate "independently" one would assume all hanging out at jaspers, gilhoolys etc...
Scott B. would have you believe there are 20 active Families in America so he can sell more books.
The overall information on this Forum is much better & more honest even if there are disagreements.
There's still at least 7 members of Kansas City but, aside from that paltry figure, you can't read too much into titles at this point with a place like KC. They're relatively meaningless.
Im not saying I believe everything Scott says and writes. But this was reported from a funeral. If these guys discussed getting together to be pallbearers they probably associate more often then we think... its not defunct imo. Its a small crew of closely connected guys, barely viable. But these guys grew up around each other for yrs, some familial ties likely. They are not some loosely connected desperados coming together from different families. Some may be passionate about it and want it to continue, some dont. But, defunct as of right now-no
In terms of the Ragusa funeral & the pallbearers, it wasnt me or LE or me claiming LE told me something. It was in the newspaper obit lol. Simple Google search.
Tonyd621 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 08, 2020 4:18 pm
There is at least 6 made guys in kc still. And according to scott b at the funeral in march of joey ragusa, five made guys were noted as pallbearers.
"Sciortino, alleged underboss Peter (Las Vegas Pete) Simone, respected advisor Frank DeLuna and reputed capos Joseph (Joe Pete) Simone and William (Little Willie) Cammisano."
So they dont operate "independently" one would assume all hanging out at jaspers, gilhoolys etc...
Scott B. would have you believe there are 20 active Families in America so he can sell more books.
The overall information on this Forum is much better & more honest even if there are disagreements.
Scott B was reporting what he saw or what LE sources based out of missouri saw. He didnt make it up.
Dont get upset with me bc it wasnt on an fbi memo to prove 100% accuracy.
What ScottB says LE says and what LE actually says are often two very different things.
Pogo
Yeah and what LE says and what LE is actively pursuing is two different things. If you believe every declassified memo, press briefing, 302, 772, 473 etc then you are dumber than you sound.
The newspaper obituary identified all of those names as made members with those ranks? I'd like to see it please.
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
