Bonanno crime family street boss locked up

[B.]

In the last 30 years, books and the media have constantly tried to make it seem like the younger guys have corrupted the values of the older generations, but most government witnesses have been veteran members. Younger members are not any more likely to flip than old members. I don't have time to look at the actual stats, but I would be willing to bet that most witnesses have been close to middle age or above and made for more than five years.

With each generation, sources both inside and out of the mob say that the new guys are ruining everything, that they're going to destroy the mob, the recruitment pool is drying up, they're greedy, disloyal, etc. It's been said for as long as the mob has been in the US it seems. No doubt each generation is a little bit different and less culturally Italian/Sicilian, but even people in Italy/Sicily are less traditional than their ancestors. Older members are known to be just as greedy and disloyal, too.

My point is, I don't think the mob is ever as bad off as some say just because they aren't as "old school" as they once were. I do believe it will continue to grow more and more difficult to have the same size and influence, but this is an organization that has weathered more than any other criminal group yet they still continue on. "Old school" is a relative term and age has always been almost meaningless when it comes to being considered a competent, loyal member.

[brianwellbrock]

Yeah I have thought about that too. With the Bonnano's you had guys in their 30's like Daniel Mongeli, Robert LIno, and Anthony AIello taking 25-30 year deals on the chin, while you had guys in their 60's all flipping.

[Lupara]

That's speaks for itself, it's easier to do jail time when you're young than when your old.

[Pogo The Clown]

That and the younger guy's may not be as jaded on the whole thing like some of the old timers.


Pogo

[Five Felonies]

With each generation, sources both inside and out of the mob say that the new guys are ruining everything, that they're going to destroy the mob, the recruitment pool is drying up, they're greedy, disloyal, etc.

ditto for street gangs and outside of the criminal world as well. we see it all the time with regards to how everything was better back in the day so it seems to be ingrained in our dna to a certain extent, maybe it's some sort of defense mechanism to help people get over their own shortcomings.

[East Bronx]

we see it all the time with regards to how everything was better back in the day so it seems to be ingrained in our dna to a certain extent, maybe it's some sort of defense mechanism to help people get over their own shortcomings.

It applies everywhere, not just the street. When you're fifty, believe it or not, you're going to believe that everything was "better" when you were twenty. It's human nature. If it's a "defense mechanism," it's to help people deal with aging, not necessarily to get over their shortcomings. I know you don't believe it. But in 2035, you're gonna be yearning for 2015.

I don't want to sound like a dick, but I'm a successful man. Yet I have plenty of shortcomings, but I recognize them and deal with them accordingly. But I'm completely guilty of believing that everything was "better" thirty years ago, and so will you when your time comes.

[Ivan]

When you're fifty, believe it or not, you're going to believe that everything was "better" when you were twenty. It's human nature. If it's a "defense mechanism," it's to help people deal with aging, not necessarily to get over their shortcomings. I know you don't believe it. But in 2035, you're gonna be yearning for 2015.

I agree, though I'm not sure this applies to everyone. I prefer the way things are now to the way they were in 90s and 2000s when I was in my teens and 20s.

The only example I can think of myself having done this is I'm one of those "music sucks now there's no good music anymore" people, but I started doing that in the mid to late 90s well before I even turned 20.

I imagine I don't have that "things were better when I was younger" thing going on because I grew up poor but I'm not poor anymore. Being young sucks for some people.

[Five Felonies]

But I'm completely guilty of believing that everything was "better" thirty years ago, and so will you when your time comes.

the reference you made to aging is a good point, i guess things are always going to seem better when you don't have to get up 5 times a night to pee! it just seems to me that when people refer to earlier times being better, they do put most of the focus on the positives of whatever era in question. even in my short life it seems like the association of great memories with a particular time are powerful enough to help us overlook the negatives. we see it all the time when boxing is discussed, about how great things were back in the day. granted, there were a bunch of iconic fighters back then, but people seem to forget the sleazy corruption and exploitation that went hand in hand with the good. as a passionate nyc guy, i'm sure you look back on decades past with warm feelings, but for as much of a pain in the ass as the modern day hipsters are, they seem preferable to the junkies and killers of yesterday. food is a good one though, even in my short life i've seen a notable decrease in the quality and the care that goes with it to an extent, but on the flip side we've seen a real focus on fresh and innovative ideas. look at beer, just a decade or so ago people thought michelob was a good beer, look what we have available today! then again, what the hell do i know!

[East Bronx]

I imagine I don't have that "things were better when I was younger" thing going on because I grew up poor but I'm not poor anymore. Being young sucks for some people.

I grew up in a cold-water walk-up in the Belmont section of the Bronx. We didn't have three nickels to rub together when I was a kid. But I understand what you're saying. Looking back on a childhood of poverty has to be ten times worse when you're still broke at fifty years old. But in those cases, the person to blame for that is often the guy looking back at you in the mirror.

People are responsible for "breaking the chain" in their lives. Whether it's child abuse, addiction, or what have you. There comes a point where you have to say to yourself, "Okay, my parents were poor, or they were outright fuck-ups. But I'm a middle-aged man now, and today it's on me to better myself."

Two cents from a wizened and cranky old fart.

[dixiemafia]

I agree PB. I could cope better when I was hungry as an adult (which really hasn't happened much thankfully) than when I was a kid and hungry. When my folks split I lived with my Mom as I couldn't get along with my old man the older I got, plus he lived an hour and half away and when you have only went to one school and are close with your classmates for that long (had the same school mates from K-12) I didn't want to leave. My Mom tried the best she could, but was suddenly stuck paying for a teenager and a car and house note, etc. so we barely had much. Then I was on free lunch which helped big time. I remember her even signing up for food stamps and told they would give her $17 a week and should told them to shove it up their ass But that's how it always goes, you got some with $750 a month in food stamps and selling them and the ones that need them can't get on it. So I do remember going hungry during the summers so I would spend weeks at a time with my best friend and his family knew why as well. From Kindergarten on until we graduated I spent at least two weekends a month there during school and a week at a time in the summer. Life was simple then even though we are talking mid to late 80's to the late 90's. When I was real little we only got 3 channels, and the 4th you would have to turn the antenna to get but you lost at least 2 of the other channels Then my best friends Dad bought Primestar satellite and boy we thought we were rolling then for sure. Before you know it, we done figured out his password so we could watch the porn channels

My nephews and son all 3 tell me they can't wait to grow up (ages 19, 14 and 11 all by September) and I just laugh and say this is what they'll enjoy most. No worries over bills and feeding kids, etc. and I tell them not to wish their life away. If I could go back I don't think I would because that would mean I wouldn't have my son of nephews, but I do miss being a kid. I know PB will laugh when I say this, but the 80's were so much more simple than these days. I'm sure he would say the same about his childhood too.

I also agree about "breaking the chain". I make more an hour than my parents ever have and I'm not trying to down them or dog them. Now they are more well off than they have ever been and I'm glad for it. But when I graduated I was kind of lost as I had plans to become a welder, but my teacher we highly respected was fired the year before and I lost my love for welding even though I finished first in my class. But once I started on a line crew there was no way I was letting that opportunity slip, and I'm not trying to be a badass and say I earned it all but I was worked like a damn dog when I started as most linemen are hard on grunts (new guys, ground hands). Summers in Alabama SUCK and working 10-12 hours a day in it was/is a bitch! At one time I could hand dig a hole in less than 30 minutes in my prime by myself. Regular sized hole is 10% the height of the pole plus 2. 45 foot pole requires a 6.5 foot hole (10% is 4.5 foot plus 2 more) and you used 8 foot post hole diggers and an 8 foot spade. Them things would kick your ass until you got used to them. But I refused to be held down and be lazy and that will generally get anyone on up the ladder and making good money. I'm on the side of being lazy doesn't earn you shit.