Buffalo/Ontario Mob Acitivity

[stubbs]

It was also revealed that Buffalo was in contact with mobsters in nyc and had to seek their approval for certain decisions in the family. Im not sayin Buffalo is on the level of the Gambinos but Buffalo def appears to be active.

This is a possible working theory. Buffalo are not in charge of their own shit anymore and answer to others.


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More questions:

Who’s really controlling the Todaro/Buffalo family? Are they controlled by the Bonanno family?

Do the Bonannos have made members in Ontario? The Violi bust details indicated they were making new members of the Bonannos in Canada. Violi was even at a Bonanno ceremony, which is odd because he’s in the Buffalo family.

Do the Gambinos factor into the equation in Ontario at all? In terms of connections or anything. They seem to have had high level meetings in Toronto but we don’t have a ton of info.

[Pogo The Clown]

Not sure why Leonard Falzone wasn't on the list. He's also dead.

And we can obviously include Domenico Violi and Rocco Luppino among the living members.

Falzone was in prison at the time. Could be why he wasn't included. Either that or he was made when he was released from prison. Another living member are Natale Luppino. A possible living member is FNU Brindinsi (named as a member on the 2006 chart according to that article about it).


Pogo

[stubbs]

Yes it gets kind of confusing, just to have a simple detailed conversation about who is on each side of this war can go in so many directions. Manning says that the Musitano hits are not connected to the Papalia hit, but more of a turf war. So if I'm reading this correctly, the Rizzuto and Musitano factions are on one side. The other side I believe its Buffalo , the Bonannos, and some Ndrangheta. Then there are non mafia type groups on each side too.

rizzuto's, musitano and caruana-cuntrera are probably on one side and the bonannos and buffalo (violi-luppino) on the other, i don't know if some ndrangheta member is involved or support some faction

Guys that might of been made by the Rizzutos after they tried to break away from Bonannos. Are they considered even made in LCN. That would include Pat Musitano.

And if Rizzutos broke away and considered themselves their own family, then made non-Italians like Reynald and Joe Bravo, would they be recognized as made by the other families? Moot point for Bravo because he’s dead. But if they dont recognize Reynald as being made, does he have to be killed for killing Sal Montagna who was a made guy?

[mobinfiltrator]

It was also revealed that Buffalo was in contact with mobsters in nyc and had to seek their approval for certain decisions in the family. Im not sayin Buffalo is on the level of the Gambinos but Buffalo def appears to be active.

This is a possible working theory. Buffalo are not in charge of their own shit anymore and answer to others.


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More questions:

Who’s really controlling the Todaro/Buffalo family? Are they controlled by the Bonanno family?

Do the Bonannos have made members in Ontario? The Violi bust details indicated they were making new members of the Bonannos in Canada. Violi was even at a Bonanno ceremony, which is odd because he’s in the Buffalo family.

Do the Gambinos factor into the equation in Ontario at all? In terms of connections or anything. They seem to have had high level meetings in Toronto but we don’t have a ton of info.

Im starting to think so. Ill ask Garcia.


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[Moscone65]

Joe bravo looked italian, acted Italian, had a fake Italian name (joe bravo), spoke Italian, blended in while in Sicily. For all intensive purposes I think he was one of the exceptions to the rule, if there ever was to be one. I could see Vito making joe but not reynald. I’m pretty sure reynald should be killed regardless or not if he was made, as he did kill a made member with seemingly no permission, but tbh I don’t think montagna was that well liked because he wanted too much kick up, he squeezed everyone. So it ends up being like the people like Sammy Gravano, he should be killed but nobody he put away is alive or out of jail so it’s probably not gonna happen.

[Wiseguy]

Falzone was in prison at the time. Could be why he wasn't included. Either that or he was made when he was released from prison. Another living member are Natale Luppino. A possible living member is FNU Brindinsi (named as a member on the 2006 chart according to that article about it).


Pogo

So that is 10 members from the 1997 list + Violi, the two Luppinos, and Brindisi. 14 members accounted for.

Looking at it another way, at least 7 have died since the feds had the family at 23 members in 2006, which would be 16 members.

14-16 members. The math speaks for itself.

When I see some evidence for the family having twice those numbers, beyond theoretical cross-border recruiting pools, and a passing comment by Violi, maybe I'll rethink things.

[mobinfiltrator]

It was also revealed that Buffalo was in contact with mobsters in nyc and had to seek their approval for certain decisions in the family. Im not sayin Buffalo is on the level of the Gambinos but Buffalo def appears to be active.

This is a possible working theory. Buffalo are not in charge of their own shit anymore and answer to others.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

More questions:

Who’s really controlling the Todaro/Buffalo family? Are they controlled by the Bonanno family?

Do the Bonannos have made members in Ontario? The Violi bust details indicated they were making new members of the Bonannos in Canada. Violi was even at a Bonanno ceremony, which is odd because he’s in the Buffalo family.

Do the Gambinos factor into the equation in Ontario at all? In terms of connections or anything. They seem to have had high level meetings in Toronto but we don’t have a ton of info.

From Jack Garcia. Gambinos had nothing to do with Canada. It was all Bonnano’s.


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[mobinfiltrator]

Falzone was in prison at the time. Could be why he wasn't included. Either that or he was made when he was released from prison. Another living member are Natale Luppino. A possible living member is FNU Brindinsi (named as a member on the 2006 chart according to that article about it).


Pogo

So that is 10 members from the 1997 list + Violi, the two Luppinos, and Brindisi. 14 members accounted for.

Looking at it another way, at least 7 have died since the feds had the family at 23 members in 2006, which would be 16 members.

14-16 members. The math speaks for itself.

When I see some evidence for the family having twice those numbers beyond theoretical cross-border recruiting pools, and a passing comment by Violi, maybe I'll rethink things.

So you’re admitting theres still an active unit in Buffalo? [emoji3]


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[Wiseguy]

So you’re admitting theres still an active unit in Buffalo? [emoji3]


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I'm saying what I've always said. There are still some active Buffalo LCN members. But we've seen the same thing involving other areas (NE Pennsylvania, Pittsburgh, Kansas City, etc) where there's no formally structured, viable family left.

[Frank]

What does everyone think of the possibility that Johnny Papalia was under the Rizzutos, and of course at that time the Bonannos.

[Frank]

Mobinfitrator you say there is a possibility that Johnny Papalia was under the Rizzutos, possible Bonanno member then, not Buffalo??

[TommyGambino]

It was also revealed that Buffalo was in contact with mobsters in nyc and had to seek their approval for certain decisions in the family. Im not sayin Buffalo is on the level of the Gambinos but Buffalo def appears to be active.

This is a possible working theory. Buffalo are not in charge of their own shit anymore and answer to others.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

More questions:

Who’s really controlling the Todaro/Buffalo family? Are they controlled by the Bonanno family?

Do the Bonannos have made members in Ontario? The Violi bust details indicated they were making new members of the Bonannos in Canada. Violi was even at a Bonanno ceremony, which is odd because he’s in the Buffalo family.

Do the Gambinos factor into the equation in Ontario at all? In terms of connections or anything. They seem to have had high level meetings in Toronto but we don’t have a ton of info.

From Jack Garcia. Gambinos had nothing to do with Canada. It was all Bonnano’s.


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Garcia wasnt around the sicilian gambino's, and he's almost 20 years out of date, he's no authority on who is in charge in that family now.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Falzone was in prison at the time. Could be why he wasn't included. Either that or he was made when he was released from prison. Another living member are Natale Luppino. A possible living member is FNU Brindinsi (named as a member on the 2006 chart according to that article about it).


Pogo

So that is 10 members from the 1997 list + Violi, the two Luppinos, and Brindisi. 14 members accounted for.

Looking at it another way, at least 7 have died since the feds had the family at 23 members in 2006, which would be 16 members.

14-16 members. The math speaks for itself.

When I see some evidence for the family having twice those numbers, beyond theoretical cross-border recruiting pools, and a passing comment by Violi, maybe I'll rethink things.

Yeah, cause making 20 guys in, 20, years, is like, impossible.


Especially considering, theoretical cross-border recruiting, n’all.


Don’t let any of that there evidence n all (tapes from a made guy, confirmation of activity by a detective who personally did undercover work in that exact region and actually even met Buffalo wise guys, good explanations on why the FEDS issued their respective statements on viability of Buffalo etc etc) get in the way of your narrative bud

[SonnyBlackstein]

Buffalo Detective just got back to me. He says they are still in play, but for higher end stuff, not street level stuff. Gaming etc

@ Pogo and Wiseguy: any change in your position? Nothing? Nope? A Buffalo detective now also believes in Santa?

...so the count is now two local detectives and one Wiseguy caught on tape.

What are the numbers we need to hit before it’s credible?

[Pogo The Clown]

All of that "evidence" has either been debunked or never held any water to begin with.


For example the 911/terrorism explanation (which has been used to explain away several defunct families already). Budget cuts would have affected all the OC squads across the country. Not just Buffalo. So why haven't we seen the NY, Chicago, Philly, Boston and NJ offices declare their respective families defunct? Why have they continued to bring cases almost 20 years since 9/11? More to the point why are the NY state, local LE and a former prosecutor also saying Buffalo is defunct? Are they all part of this grand conspiracy to declare Buffalo gone when it isn't?


As to what PM has said, with all due respect to him, he has not confirmed anything about current Buffalo activity. Just his own opinions and theories that keep changing.

Massive foundations in Buffalo.

they are still in play, but for higher end stuff, not street level stuff.

This is a possible working theory. Buffalo are not in charge of their own shit anymore and answer to others.

Im starting to think that maybe Buffalo are just collecting from Canada.

So which is it? Either way he, again all due respect, is not in better position to know about the current make up of Buffalo than the head of the FBI Buffalo office who has categorilcally said it is done.


Pogo