Buffalo/Ontario Mob Acitivity

[eboli]

I get what you're saying. And if you zoom the lens in so that the focus is on NYC, the groups outside of NYC are largely irrelevant and obsolete. But if you take that same microscope and zoom out even farther, you'll see that even the NYC LCN is largely irrelevant. They are not among the top ten criminal organizations in the world, so why not label them defunct since, unless barring some significant immigration patterns, are on a slow decline.

I'm viewing it from a different lenses and there's no single lens fits all.

In my opinion the defunct label should be viewed on two levels. You have the defunct label for a family that's no longer able to operate, function on it's own. And there's the defunct label for cosa nostra presence in general. I think the FBI applies the former with expectations eventually that it leads to the latter, irregardless of overall trends and based on current developments. Since they organized the whole thing like a corporation with a board of directors you have the parent company and the subsidiaries. A loss-making subsidiary is uncommon to make a comeback, but it can happen.

[Fughedaboutit]

Man this is quite the active thread lol

[stubbs]

My guess is it’s a mix of both sides:

The Buffalo family was pretty weak in the early to mid 2000s, and there were maybe less than 10 made guys left. They were only involved in gambling and some smaller rackets and kicked up to Todaro, who sat back and collected envelopes while essentially being almost 100% legit, selling pizzas and occasionally meditating disputes. So, roughly the size like New Orleans in the early 90s before their casino bust or Tampa around year 2000.

But instead of Buffalo dying out through attrition like most other smaller families, massve changes happen: the Rizzutos broke away from the Bonannos, then the Rizzutos had a massive power vacuum starting around 2006 due to the Project Colisee bust, and Sal Montagna got deported to Canada while Vito Rizzuto was away.

So the Bonannos naturally wanted to reclaim their turf and get Montreal back in line. While Montreal and Quebec are under historically under the Bonanno flag, Ontario has historically been under the Buffalo flag.

So the Bonannos reached out to Todaro roughly around 2010-2014 or so and told him to beef up his family. Buffalo needed new members to strengthen their hold over Ontario, which increases the Bonannos control and hold over Quebec more powerful. This is why that Bonanno guy was in Canada and meeting with everyone, including Dom Violi.

Guys like Dom Violi gets made in 2015 to Buffalo and a lot of other guys get made too. And most of the people made by Buffalo are already heavy, like the Violis who are mafia legacy. So Buffalo was making people who were already big time earners, who just so happened not to be made formally in LNC.

But it’s the Bonannos behind the scenes in Buffalo/Ontario directing everything, telling Todaro to beef up his family. Sort of like the Binos being the power behind the DeClavacantes in Jersey.

This aligns with the Musitanos getting eliminated: They were aligned with the Rizzutos and the new players in Ontario want to take back control under the Bonanno and Buffalo flags. Hamilton is a proxy war for everything else going on across Canada.

To me it reminds me of Philly roughly 89-92: They should’ve been finished after the Scarfo busts and all of the rats like Leonetti. Or, at least devolve into a small-time street gang of punks. But somehow in the 90s Ligambi was able to rebuild everything and now the family is in a relatively good position.

So Wiseguy and Pogo aren’t wrong, there havent been busts for a long time in Buffalo because Buffalo was almost defunct, but the Bonannos pushed them to rebuild. Which is why we saw the huge Violi bust recently. The biggest question that remains is how many people are made and active in Buffalo area verses in Canada? I think it’s very telling a Canadian like Violi was made underboss.

[scagghiuni]

So Wiseguy and Pogo aren’t wrong, there havent been busts for a long time in Buffalo because Buffalo was almost defunct, but the Bonannos pushed them to rebuild. Which is why we saw the huge Violi bust recently. The biggest question that remains is how many people are made and active in Buffalo area verses in Canada? I think it’s very telling a Canadian like Violi was made underboss.

i'm agree the bonanno's are behind this, they forced todaro to rebuild magaddino family in order to have more allies in canada to fight the rizzuto faction... according to violi 30 made members (included the ones living in the states), but of course fbi (that knows nothing about canada) said that the family is dead, so violi wiretaps have no value

[Moscone65]

Revenge can take a long time in the world of the mafia. This could be bonnano revenge for the rizzutos splitting off back in the early 2000’s. At that time the bonnanos became weak with mass imo flipping ect, so they had to rebuild, focus on their problems in nyc. Now that they are in a more stable position, they are trying to get back control and assert themselves with the help of the groups still under their control. (Cotronis/arcuris in montreal, papalias in Hamilton, buffalo and their Canadian allies/crews such as the Luppinos.)

[CabriniGreen]

My guess is it’s a mix of both sides:

The Buffalo family was pretty weak in the early to mid 2000s, and there were maybe less than 10 made guys left. They were only involved in gambling and some smaller rackets and kicked up to Todaro, who sat back and collected envelopes while essentially being almost 100% legit, selling pizzas and occasionally meditating disputes. So, roughly the size like New Orleans in the early 90s before their casino bust or Tampa around year 2000.

But instead of Buffalo dying out through attrition like most other smaller families, massve changes happen: the Rizzutos broke away from the Bonannos, then the Rizzutos had a massive power vacuum starting around 2006 due to the Project Colisee bust, and Sal Montagna got deported to Canada while Vito Rizzuto was away.

So the Bonannos naturally wanted to reclaim their turf and get Montreal back in line. While Montreal and Quebec are under historically under the Bonanno flag, Ontario has historically been under the Buffalo flag.

So the Bonannos reached out to Todaro roughly around 2010-2014 or so and told him to beef up his family. Buffalo needed new members to strengthen their hold over Ontario, which increases the Bonannos control and hold over Quebec more powerful. This is why that Bonanno guy was in Canada and meeting with everyone, including Dom Violi.

Guys like Dom Violi gets made in 2015 to Buffalo and a lot of other guys get made too. And most of the people made by Buffalo are already heavy, like the Violis who are mafia legacy. So Buffalo was making people who were already big time earners, who just so happened not to be made formally in LNC.

But it’s the Bonannos behind the scenes in Buffalo/Ontario directing everything, telling Todaro to beef up his family. Sort of like the Binos being the power behind the DeClavacantes in Jersey.

This aligns with the Musitanos getting eliminated: They were aligned with the Rizzutos and the new players in Ontario want to take back control under the Bonanno and Buffalo flags. Hamilton is a proxy war for everything else going on across Canada.

To me it reminds me of Philly roughly 89-92: They should’ve been finished after the Scarfo busts and all of the rats like Leonetti. Or, at least devolve into a small-time street gang of punks. But somehow in the 90s Ligambi was able to rebuild everything and now the family is in a relatively good position.

So Wiseguy and Pogo aren’t wrong, there havent been busts for a long time in Buffalo because Buffalo was almost defunct, but the Bonannos pushed them to rebuild. Which is why we saw the huge Violi bust recently. The biggest question that remains is how many people are made and active in Buffalo area verses in Canada? I think it’s very telling a Canadian like Violi was made underboss.

I think this might possibly be dead on accurate ..... time will tell.... another I document within the next couple years will go along way.... And the Violis are far from finished I think.....

[CabriniGreen]

should say indictment, sorry...

[Lupara]

Man this is quite the active thread lol

It reigns supreme and has crushed the Frank Cali gone thread. Perhaps we should thank Pogo and Wiseguy for igniting this debate. Not sure whether that was their intention but it seems to have worked out. [emoji846]

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[CabriniGreen]

Another question I have is, exactly who in NY was giving, or gave this directive?

Zummo? Hes a Mancuso guy? It's too much to speculate on, but it would be interesting if the Canadian faction was supporting him in NY.

Are the factions up there consolidated into one again? If so, under who's leadership? A Rizzuto, was Joe Violi going to get it? Someone else?

[CabriniGreen]

Man this is quite the active thread lol

It reigns supreme and has crushed the Frank Cali gone thread. Perhaps we should thank Pogo and Wiseguy for igniting this debate. Not sure whether that was their intention but it seems to have worked out. [emoji846]

Verstuurd vanaf mijn H3113 met Tapatalk

Maybe throw a thanks to Manning too,... his presence was the catalyst....

[Lupara]

So Wiseguy and Pogo aren’t wrong, there havent been busts for a long time in Buffalo because Buffalo was almost defunct, but the Bonannos pushed them to rebuild. Which is why we saw the huge Violi bust recently. The biggest question that remains is how many people are made and active in Buffalo area verses in Canada? I think it’s very telling a Canadian like Violi was made underboss.

i'm agree the bonanno's are behind this, they forced todaro to rebuild magaddino family in order to have more allies in canada to fight the rizzuto faction... according to violi 30 made members (included the ones living in the states), but of course fbi (that knows nothing about canada) said that the family is dead, so violi wiretaps have no value

Forcing is a big word. They may have requested it. But I have my doubts about this theory. The Bonannos have plenty of guys themselves and allies in Montreal. I don't see why they would need Buffalo to rebuild so they can be stronger in their own turf.

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[Lupara]

Man this is quite the active thread lol

It reigns supreme and has crushed the Frank Cali gone thread. Perhaps we should thank Pogo and Wiseguy for igniting this debate. Not sure whether that was their intention but it seems to have worked out. [emoji846]

Verstuurd vanaf mijn H3113 met Tapatalk

Maybe throw a thanks to Manning too,... his presence was the catalyst....

Sure thing.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn H3113 met Tapatalk

[Lupara]

My guess is it’s a mix of both sides:

The Buffalo family was pretty weak in the early to mid 2000s, and there were maybe less than 10 made guys left. They were only involved in gambling and some smaller rackets and kicked up to Todaro, who sat back and collected envelopes while essentially being almost 100% legit, selling pizzas and occasionally meditating disputes. So, roughly the size like New Orleans in the early 90s before their casino bust or Tampa around year 2000.

But instead of Buffalo dying out through attrition like most other smaller families, massve changes happen: the Rizzutos broke away from the Bonannos, then the Rizzutos had a massive power vacuum starting around 2006 due to the Project Colisee bust, and Sal Montagna got deported to Canada while Vito Rizzuto was away.

So the Bonannos naturally wanted to reclaim their turf and get Montreal back in line. While Montreal and Quebec are under historically under the Bonanno flag, Ontario has historically been under the Buffalo flag.

So the Bonannos reached out to Todaro roughly around 2010-2014 or so and told him to beef up his family. Buffalo needed new members to strengthen their hold over Ontario, which increases the Bonannos control and hold over Quebec more powerful. This is why that Bonanno guy was in Canada and meeting with everyone, including Dom Violi.

Guys like Dom Violi gets made in 2015 to Buffalo and a lot of other guys get made too. And most of the people made by Buffalo are already heavy, like the Violis who are mafia legacy. So Buffalo was making people who were already big time earners, who just so happened not to be made formally in LNC.

But it’s the Bonannos behind the scenes in Buffalo/Ontario directing everything, telling Todaro to beef up his family. Sort of like the Binos being the power behind the DeClavacantes in Jersey.

This aligns with the Musitanos getting eliminated: They were aligned with the Rizzutos and the new players in Ontario want to take back control under the Bonanno and Buffalo flags. Hamilton is a proxy war for everything else going on across Canada.

To me it reminds me of Philly roughly 89-92: They should’ve been finished after the Scarfo busts and all of the rats like Leonetti. Or, at least devolve into a small-time street gang of punks. But somehow in the 90s Ligambi was able to rebuild everything and now the family is in a relatively good position.

So Wiseguy and Pogo aren’t wrong, there havent been busts for a long time in Buffalo because Buffalo was almost defunct, but the Bonannos pushed them to rebuild. Which is why we saw the huge Violi bust recently. The biggest question that remains is how many people are made and active in Buffalo area verses in Canada? I think it’s very telling a Canadian like Violi was made underboss.

I think this might possibly be dead on accurate ..... time will tell.... another I document within the next couple years will go along way.... And the Violis are far from finished I think.....

Except for the only ten guys left. Buffalo had 20-30 members in the 2000s.

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[NickleCity]

Man this is quite the active thread lol

It reigns supreme and has crushed the Frank Cali gone thread. Perhaps we should thank Pogo and Wiseguy for igniting this debate. Not sure whether that was their intention but it seems to have worked out. [emoji846]

Verstuurd vanaf mijn H3113 met Tapatalk

Maybe throw a thanks to Manning too,... his presence was the catalyst....

A definite thanks to Manning! Hope to hear more of his insight.

[scagghiuni]

Forcing is a big word. They may have requested it. But I have my doubts about this theory. The Bonannos have plenty of guys themselves and allies in Montreal. I don't see why they would need Buffalo to rebuild so they can be stronger in their own turf.

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i dont know, the most logic thing is that they just made the violi's in the bonanno family (like their father) and not in the buffalo one, but in the wiretaps violi talked he was a buffalo member so it means they still had influence in ontario while the bonanno's had not members (they are all in montreal)