General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Patrickgold
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

Post by Patrickgold »

funkster wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:11 pm I've looked up the Dungeon's owner in the past, I dont recall the guys name but the City of Chicago's records show he lives in....wait for it...Elmwood Park. Also, wasn't Cassano busted a few years back for extortion? Another "not outfit linked" bust that appears to be linked.
So the place that Nesbit worked out of was at 2452 W Augusta. The Dungeon which I believe is owned by a relative of Jimmy I is at 1627 W Grand Ave so different place but in the same area.

Angelo Damico being involved in the Outfit is news to me too. Another person to add on the list. A lot of people were saying Marco Damico was retired before he died bc he was never indicted. I always heard the opposite that he was still running gambling operations. I would even go as far to say he could have been the head of EP crew considering Dote and these other guys were working for him. Obviously this document proves that he was still active.

Gene Cassano was indicted in 2021 for some extortion and once again nothing about the Outfit is mentioned. I also posted links to the Frontier indictment in 2019 and the Nesbit indictment. No mention of Outfit.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/cri ... story.html

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/pr/ch ... g-business

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/press ... 6/download
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Snakes
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Patrickgold wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 7:28 am
funkster wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:11 pm I've looked up the Dungeon's owner in the past, I dont recall the guys name but the City of Chicago's records show he lives in....wait for it...Elmwood Park. Also, wasn't Cassano busted a few years back for extortion? Another "not outfit linked" bust that appears to be linked.
So the place that Nesbit worked out of was at 2452 W Augusta. The Dungeon which I believe is owned by a relative of Jimmy I is at 1627 W Grand Ave so different place but in the same area.

Angelo Damico being involved in the Outfit is news to me too. Another person to add on the list. A lot of people were saying Marco Damico was retired before he died bc he was never indicted. I always heard the opposite that he was still running gambling operations. I would even go as far to say he could have been the head of EP crew considering Dote and these other guys were working for him. Obviously this document proves that he was still active.

Gene Cassano was indicted in 2021 for some extortion and once again nothing about the Outfit is mentioned. I also posted links to the Frontier indictment in 2019 and the Nesbit indictment. No mention of Outfit.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/cri ... story.html

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/pr/ch ... g-business

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/press ... 6/download
The issue is if Marco was never made, who did these guys report to? Another crew, a la Frank Calabrese's crew being a sub-group of Chinatown? Or, if it is still a formal crew, who got put in charge? If it isn't Fratto, did they make Gagliano or one of the Cassanos and put them in charge? The only other for-sure made guys from that crew still left are Andriacchi and Magnafichi, neither of whom are likely. Maybe Mandell going to Vena (EP part of GA or is Vena in some type of overall leadership role?) could give us a clue, but there are still lots of questions.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Snakes wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 8:44 am
Patrickgold wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 7:28 am
funkster wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:11 pm I've looked up the Dungeon's owner in the past, I dont recall the guys name but the City of Chicago's records show he lives in....wait for it...Elmwood Park. Also, wasn't Cassano busted a few years back for extortion? Another "not outfit linked" bust that appears to be linked.
So the place that Nesbit worked out of was at 2452 W Augusta. The Dungeon which I believe is owned by a relative of Jimmy I is at 1627 W Grand Ave so different place but in the same area.

Angelo Damico being involved in the Outfit is news to me too. Another person to add on the list. A lot of people were saying Marco Damico was retired before he died bc he was never indicted. I always heard the opposite that he was still running gambling operations. I would even go as far to say he could have been the head of EP crew considering Dote and these other guys were working for him. Obviously this document proves that he was still active.

Gene Cassano was indicted in 2021 for some extortion and once again nothing about the Outfit is mentioned. I also posted links to the Frontier indictment in 2019 and the Nesbit indictment. No mention of Outfit.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/cri ... story.html

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/pr/ch ... g-business

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/press ... 6/download
The issue is if Marco was never made, who did these guys report to? Another crew, a la Frank Calabrese's crew being a sub-group of Chinatown? Or, if it is still a formal crew, who got put in charge? If it isn't Fratto, did they make Gagliano or one of the Cassanos and put them in charge? The only other for-sure made guys from that crew still left are Andriacchi and Magnafichi, neither of whom are likely. Maybe Mandell going to Vena (EP part of GA or is Vena in some type of overall leadership role?) could give us a clue, but there are still lots of questions.
You’re right, I was looking at it more from the perspective that Marco was made, which I believe he was. In my opinion he was around the top guys to much not to be made. But that’s just my personal opinion.

Maybe it was the GA crew that was disbanded and not EP. You’re right, a lot of questions.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Patrickgold wrote: Fri May 12, 2023 10:36 am The place on Lexington and Racine was not the survivors club that the Wild Bunch were working out of. It could have easily moved though. The Survivor’s club where Aleman worked out of was were Busy Burger is now. Interesting story about the club on Lexington and Racine. I knew some cops that worked that area and about 10 or so years ago and some blacks were in front of the club and asked someone outside smoking if he wanted to buy drugs. The people in the club came out and beat the shit out of them really bad. They were all unconscious when they arrived and their pockets were turned inside out. They beat them up and took their drugs and money and then went back inside and turned the lights off and locked the doors. The blacks were taken to the hospital. They didn’t mess around in that club.
I had totally forgotten about Busy Burger. It's been 20 years of so since I moved out of the neighborhood and only make it back once a year if I'm lucky.
Not sure why I always referred to that club as the Survivors. Harry's cousin Nick worked for me part time and was always at that card game on Tuesdays, maybe I got it from him? Anyway, I stand corrected.

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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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It just seems so unlikely that Marco wasn’t a made guy. It always felt like some argument point that Fosco liked to hang his hat on. Who knows….
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Snakes
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Coloboy wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:33 am It just seems so unlikely that Marco wasn’t a made guy. It always felt like some argument point that Fosco liked to hang his hat on. Who knows….
Magnafichi also said it, though. I don't know why him saying Marco was or wasn't made would protect him -- the guy did 10+ years in prison so isn't like he wouldn't be a felon if he wasn't made.

I personally think he wasn't made before he went to prison, and by the time he got out, he didn't necessarily need it as he already had a direct line to the DiFronzos and people outside of his circle were running things.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Just ask the Don, he was always "Marco's" super fan number one lol.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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funkster wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 10:42 am Just ask the Don, he was always "Marco's" super fan number one lol.
Funny! There were some interesting characters that posted there.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Snakes wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:46 am
Coloboy wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:33 am It just seems so unlikely that Marco wasn’t a made guy. It always felt like some argument point that Fosco liked to hang his hat on. Who knows….
Magnafichi also said it, though. I don't know why him saying Marco was or wasn't made would protect him -- the guy did 10+ years in prison so isn't like he wouldn't be a felon if he wasn't made.

I personally think he wasn't made before he went to prison, and by the time he got out, he didn't necessarily need it as he already had a direct line to the DiFronzos and people outside of his circle were running things.
I know Mags said that but Mags himself is a made guy. He’s not supposed to be talking about that and even though he is talking to the media a little, it might still be in him not to be truthful about it. He did take the oath of omertà. Also, mags was out of the picture in the 2000s bc of his alcohol and prescription drug addictions among some other things. Maybe he didn’t know or wasn’t informed about Marco being made if he was in fact made in the 2000s. There is a lot of what ifs that we may never know.
Last edited by Patrickgold on Sun May 14, 2023 11:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Patrickgold wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 11:02 am
Snakes wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:46 am
Coloboy wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:33 am It just seems so unlikely that Marco wasn’t a made guy. It always felt like some argument point that Fosco liked to hang his hat on. Who knows….
Magnafichi also said it, though. I don't know why him saying Marco was or wasn't made would protect him -- the guy did 10+ years in prison so isn't like he wouldn't be a felon if he wasn't made.

I personally think he wasn't made before he went to prison, and by the time he got out, he didn't necessarily need it as he already had a direct line to the DiFronzos and people outside of his circle were running things.
I know Mags said that but Mags himself is a made guy. He’s not supposed to be talking about that and even though he is talking to the media a little, it might still be in him not to be truthful about it. He did take the oath of omertà. Also, mags was out of the picture in the 2000s bc of his alcohol and prescription drug addictions among some other things. Maybe he didn’t know or wasn’t informed about it. There is a lot of what ifs that we may never know.
As i said before, I think Mags covers for people when he says some of these things.
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Snakes
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Patrickgold wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 11:02 am
Snakes wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:46 am
Coloboy wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:33 am It just seems so unlikely that Marco wasn’t a made guy. It always felt like some argument point that Fosco liked to hang his hat on. Who knows….
Magnafichi also said it, though. I don't know why him saying Marco was or wasn't made would protect him -- the guy did 10+ years in prison so isn't like he wouldn't be a felon if he wasn't made.

I personally think he wasn't made before he went to prison, and by the time he got out, he didn't necessarily need it as he already had a direct line to the DiFronzos and people outside of his circle were running things.
I know Mags said that but Mags himself is a made guy. He’s not supposed to be talking about that and even though he is talking to the media a little, it might still be in him not to be truthful about it. He did take the oath of omertà. Also, mags was out of the picture in the 2000s bc of his alcohol and prescription drug addictions among some other things. Maybe he didn’t know or wasn’t informed about Marco being made if he was in fact made in the 2000s. There is a lot of what ifs that we may never know.
What I was getting at is I don't even think Marco would want to be made by the 2000s anyway. I don't really see what it would have gotten him and I'd almost think it would be insulting if he got made with guys 20-30 years younger than him. Nobody was going to mess with him as long as DiFronzo was alive and the power base was no longer in EP, anyway.

But you're right, there are a lot of things we don't know.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

Post by SonnyC »

Snakes wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 11:25 am
Patrickgold wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 11:02 am
Snakes wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:46 am
Coloboy wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 9:33 am It just seems so unlikely that Marco wasn’t a made guy. It always felt like some argument point that Fosco liked to hang his hat on. Who knows….
Magnafichi also said it, though. I don't know why him saying Marco was or wasn't made would protect him -- the guy did 10+ years in prison so isn't like he wouldn't be a felon if he wasn't made.

I personally think he wasn't made before he went to prison, and by the time he got out, he didn't necessarily need it as he already had a direct line to the DiFronzos and people outside of his circle were running things.
I know Mags said that but Mags himself is a made guy. He’s not supposed to be talking about that and even though he is talking to the media a little, it might still be in him not to be truthful about it. He did take the oath of omertà. Also, mags was out of the picture in the 2000s bc of his alcohol and prescription drug addictions among some other things. Maybe he didn’t know or wasn’t informed about Marco being made if he was in fact made in the 2000s. There is a lot of what ifs that we may never know.
What I was getting at is I don't even think Marco would want to be made by the 2000s anyway. I don't really see what it would have gotten him and I'd almost think it would be insulting if he got made with guys 20-30 years younger than him. Nobody was going to mess with him as long as DiFronzo was alive and the power base was no longer in EP, anyway.

But you're right, there are a lot of things we don't know.
A lot of assumptions are made based on many different things. For example 2 close friends of mine worked for Jimmy LaValley at his cabana club in the '80s. They certainly thought of him as being made guy based on his demeanor and reputation, even though we know now he was not. I've been guilty of it as well. For instance I always considered Shorty LaMantia to be a made guy based on observation and what we know about his interactions with Angelo. However, there's no proof. I dismiss Calabrese's prison conversation as Sr just tough talking. As far as Marco goes, he's another I always considered being made based on who he was around and his perceived stature. Reality may have been different.
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Snakes
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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I think Frank saying Shorty isn't even made is pretty close to confirmation of his status that you can get. The context makes it pretty clear that he wasn't made.

Just being seen around made guys and having perceived status in the organization isn't enough. Schweihs was seen around high ranking guys, but we know he wasn't made. Additionally, Nick was a guy you'd never guess was made before he took the stand.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

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Patrickgold wrote: Sun May 14, 2023 7:28 am
funkster wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:11 pm I've looked up the Dungeon's owner in the past, I dont recall the guys name but the City of Chicago's records show he lives in....wait for it...Elmwood Park. Also, wasn't Cassano busted a few years back for extortion? Another "not outfit linked" bust that appears to be linked.
So the place that Nesbit worked out of was at 2452 W Augusta. The Dungeon which I believe is owned by a relative of Jimmy I is at 1627 W Grand Ave so different place but in the same area.
As a personal tangent, the block where Nesbitt's operation was based, at least until gentrification blew up, would have been a very unlikely place for a high-end, luxury "kink dungeon" lol. All summer, you would be bowled over by the stench that blanketed that block from the festering poultry slaughterhouse behind the gas station. The area was also totally overrun by enormous rats that could be mistaken for alley cats, due to the poultry place. Not exactly a glamorous location, until pretty recently. My first ever arrest, when I was 12, was in the alley immediately behind Nesbitt's address.

------------------------------------------

Interesting to note that prostitution in the West Town area seems to have been a pretty markedly mobbed-up racket in recent years. We have confirmation that the Nesbitt thing was linked to Gary Gags now, and we also know that Panozzo was involved in prostitution in the neighborhood. On top of that, the Grand Ave "dungeon" possibly owned by an Inendino, and all of the years of talk about Bobby D and the SRO above La Scarola/Richard's. And these could be all linked to multiple crews (Cicero, Grand Ave, EP), though as others have noted, we really don't know what the structure is at this point. Grand Ave and EP may have both remained as extant crews, or could have been folded into each other and are today sub-"crews" of the same formal LCN decina. Either scenario is possible, unless and until more information emerges.

-------------------------------------------

Also worth noting again here that Chicago, at least through the 80s and 90s, had close ties to Italian OC. The EP crew, I believe, was at the center of some of this (and there is history there, with Accardo having apparent ties to the Sicilian mafia that were being investigated by Italian LE in the 70s, and the connections between the Cerones and Spavones). Much of the "Second Wave" of Sicilian/Italian immigration was concentrated in their territory, of course, and DiFronzo himself was born in Bari, presumably retaining connections to relatives back home (which could certainly be part of the context for why Pugliese OC leader and fugitive Aldo Cardellicchio was hiding out at the Harlem Ave Cafe Cappuccino location). Al Mitria is from Salerno province, which also had a network of peasani in the 1980s who were involved in some murders and other nasty stuff in Chicago (i.e., the case with corrupt CPD Pierre Zonis). The Cassanos, on the other hand, are also from Bari (I believe from Grumo Appula, specifically). If the EP crew does still exist, it would be expected that its current membership would today also reflect guys from those immigrant networks, having been integrated for decades now with the older Ital-American community.

Another question I've had is what role, if any, LaBalestra has played in recent years. I've seen people online try to claim that he is, alternatively, affiliated with either Cicero or Elmwood Park. Given that he is Pugliese and based in the Addison area, my inclination has been to assume that he is affiliated with EP. As Cavita and I recently discussed in this thread, we have some reason to believe that the Santino Colella (also from Bari) DuPage drug ring in 2008 was working for LaBalestra. But is LaBalestra a member or associate of Chicago LCN? Did he remain formally affiliated with Pugliese OC while partnered with Chicago guys? I'd guess that he is at least formally an associate, whatever other ties he may have or have had, but we have very little info to go on with him.

As a reminder, there were also indications that Al Mitria was involved with narcotics:
PolackTony wrote: Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:57 pm For years, Al Mitria was rumored to be involved in burglaries and fencing of stolen merchandise at the old Maxwell St Market (I probably bought something off of him at some point, lol). In 2001, Mitria was busted with Charles Parilli in a massive stolen goods ring. Police told the Tribune that at the time it was one of the largest recoveries of stolen goods in Chicago history (computers, appliances, toys, clothing, firearms, etc.); it took a team of 60 investigators 3 days to transport and catalog the loot, which was estimated at $2 million dollars in value and burglarized from freight train yards. Mitria and Parilli were called "alleged organized crime figures" at the time, with CPD intelligence commander of the Organized Crime Division John Guarnieri referring to Mitria as "an Elmwood Park mob crew boss". Along with the swag, it would seem that these two were involved in narcotics, as Parilli was busted at one of their storage sites with cocaine, marijuana, and $20k in a suitcase.
While we can't take Guarnieri's claim that Mitria was a "boss" at face value, it could be an indication that he was made already by this time and in charge of a sub-"crew" of associates.
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Re: General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

Post by Antiliar »

Mike was adamant that Marco wasn't made when he talked to him in the early 2000s. One reason, if I recall correctly, was that Joe A didn't want him to be made. Apparently something happened or he just didn't like him. By that point Marco didn't care since he was doing well. He didn't need to get made.
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