General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

[Coloboy]

The truth usually always lies in the middle somewhere.

IMO there is still something organized and structured there. The 28 member number gets thrown around like it is the gospel, and that the feds knew absolutely everything and everyone that was involved at the time. Much of it was probably based on Calabrese's intel as well as historical intel. We know that there is a lot Calabrese did not know, and although he was a made guy he certainly did not seem to be in the "inner-circle" like his brother was. There is also a distinct possibility that both he and Frank Jr. were "selective" shall we say in there intel, and were protecting certain groups of people.

No argument that the outfit is on a declining path and is a smallish family. However, we don't' have even a remotely full picture of what is happening and who is involved.

[Snakes]

No argument that the outfit is on a declining path and is a smallish family. However, we don't' have even a remotely full picture of what is happening and who is involved.

Yeah, I agree -- nobody is really saying otherwise. I don't really know what the big debate is.

[PolackTony]

No argument that the outfit is on a declining path and is a smallish family. However, we don't' have even a remotely full picture of what is happening and who is involved.

Yeah, I agree -- nobody is really saying otherwise. I don't really know what the big debate is.

+1. It’s nowhere near what it used to be but it’s not dead yet. That can encompass a lot of grey area and the honest answer to many of these questions is that we just don’t know and aren’t in the position to draw firm conclusions unless and until confirmatory evidence is made available.

[Patrickgold]

No argument that the outfit is on a declining path and is a smallish family. However, we don't' have even a remotely full picture of what is happening and who is involved.

Yeah, I agree -- nobody is really saying otherwise. I don't really know what the big debate is.

+1. It’s nowhere near what it used to be but it’s not dead yet. That can encompass a lot of grey area and the honest answer to many of these questions is that we just don’t know and aren’t in the position to draw firm conclusions unless and until confirmatory evidence is made available.

On top of that, there is no family near what it used to be. That’s a fact and Chicago is no different. I’m under the belief that Chicago never had a high number of made members and the FBI often confused members with associates and vise versa. We are at a time when less and less FBI agents are investigating LCN, both for good reason and also for manpower issues. But the culture of the Outfit in my opinion is too strong to just disappear

[Little_Al1991]

No argument that the outfit is on a declining path and is a smallish family. However, we don't' have even a remotely full picture of what is happening and who is involved.

Yeah, I agree -- nobody is really saying otherwise. I don't really know what the big debate is.

That’s the most reasonable view we have on the Outfit

[funkster]

None of the regulars in this thread have ever disputed that, so as Snakes said I dont know why we need to endlessly have this debate.

It appears that Stevie Bullets guy is going to host an event for his documentary or whatever it is at GiGi Rovito's restaurant, Capri.

[PolackTony]

It appears that Stevie Bullets guy is going to host an event for his documentary or whatever it is at GiGi Rovito's restaurant, Capri.

Sounds like a classy night.

You goin’?

[funkster]

It appears that Stevie Bullets guy is going to host an event for his documentary or whatever it is at GiGi Rovito's restaurant, Capri.

Sounds like a classy night.

You goin’?

lol absolutely not

[Coloboy]

May lend credence to the fact that Rovito is not really "active" in the outfit no? Can't imagine anyone who is really involved would invite someone like that to speak at their restaurant

[Patrickgold]

May lend credence to the fact that Rovito is not really "active" in the outfit no? Can't imagine anyone who is really involved would invite someone like that to speak at their restaurant

Hard to say how active he is. I saw him not to long ago at Capri with Fratto, Spina and some very big union guys i rather not name. In regards to Stevie Bullets, I’m sure Seifert and that other producer are paying for the party. Doubt Gigi is fronting the money for that guy.

[Coloboy]

May lend credence to the fact that Rovito is not really "active" in the outfit no? Can't imagine anyone who is really involved would invite someone like that to speak at their restaurant

Hard to say how active he is. I saw him not to long ago at Capri with Fratto, Spina and some very big union guys i rather not name. In regards to Stevie Bullets, I’m sure Seifert and that other producer are paying for the party. Doubt Gigi is fronting the money for that guy.

Thanks, interesting intel. Haven't heard much about Fratto for the last few years.

[funkster]

Interesting that Spina was meeting with union guys. Not particularly surprising though.

[Antiliar]

May lend credence to the fact that Rovito is not really "active" in the outfit no? Can't imagine anyone who is really involved would invite someone like that to speak at their restaurant

Hard to say how active he is. I saw him not to long ago at Capri with Fratto, Spina and some very big union guys i rather not name. In regards to Stevie Bullets, I’m sure Seifert and that other producer are paying for the party. Doubt Gigi is fronting the money for that guy.

So Rudy Fratto is still meeting with active guys. Interesting.

[funkster]

Been meaning to ask one of the deep historians, does anyone know if Les Kruse had a son? For whatever reason ive never made the connection, but I worked with a guy named Leslie Kruse some time back and he was an older guy who ended retiring only a year or so after i got there. He definitely fit the part, was a drinker, had the chains and gold bracelets, and huge Vegas guy...always went on vacation to go gambling there. Never thought about it until recently that he might be related.

[Patrickgold]

May lend credence to the fact that Rovito is not really "active" in the outfit no? Can't imagine anyone who is really involved would invite someone like that to speak at their restaurant

Hard to say how active he is. I saw him not to long ago at Capri with Fratto, Spina and some very big union guys i rather not name. In regards to Stevie Bullets, I’m sure Seifert and that other producer are paying for the party. Doubt Gigi is fronting the money for that guy.

Thanks, interesting intel. Haven't heard much about Fratto for the last few years.

Yes, he has been low key for sure. He has been hanging out there for a long time. In Gigi’s interview with the FBI he was asked if he knew Fratto. he admitted he did and said something to the effect that Fratto’s wife is a loud mouth. Fratto’s daughter married into wealth and her husband is the owner of sunny acres out in West Chicago