Buffalo/Ontario Mob Acitivity

[antimafia]

‘Ndrangheta Dynamics In The Greater Toronto Area: The Story Of An Internal Mafia Clash (Part 1)

https://bit.ly/3uTnmuZ

[SonnyBlackstein]

Fun facts.

Buffalo has a pop of around 256k. Its Italian % is around 11.7% which equates to almost exactly 30k people of Italian descent.
Around half being male would equal 15k. Under 18yrs old the US % is 24% equating to 11,400 approx males of Italian descent, 18 yrs or older.

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Interesting history on Buffalo's historical population:
1810 1,508 —
1820 2,095 38.9%
1830 8,668 313.7%
1840 18,213 110.1%
1850 42,261 132.0%
1860 81,129 92.0%
1870 117,714 45.1%
1880 155,134 31.8%
1890 255,664 64.8%
1900 352,387 37.8%
1910 423,715 20.2%
1920 506,775 19.6%
1930 573,076 13.1%
1940 575,901 0.5%
1950 580,132 0.7%
1960 532,759 −8.2%
1970 462,768 −13.1%
1980 357,870 −22.7%
1990 328,123 −8.3%
2000 292,648 −10.8%
2010 261,310 −10.7%

So looking at the above Buffalo should cease to exist by 2050 , WG just playing the long game..

[CabriniGreen]

‘Ndrangheta Dynamics In The Greater Toronto Area: The Story Of An Internal Mafia Clash (Part 1)

https://bit.ly/3uTnmuZ

This is fantastic.. where has this report bern hiding? Oh, I see it's just posted today.... it's like required reading....

[B.]

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Thirty members that could be spread throughout Buffalo, Niagara Falls, Utica, Rochester, Toronto, and Hamilton. Not including other outlying towns that historically had members. Even one member in an outlying city is significant when we're splitting hairs about a ~30 member family.

[Wiseguy]

Fun facts.

Buffalo has a pop of around 256k. Its Italian % is around 11.7% which equates to almost exactly 30k people of Italian descent.
Around half being male would equal 15k. Under 18yrs old the US % is 24% equating to 11,400 approx males of Italian descent, 18 yrs or older.

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Interesting history on Buffalo's historical population:
1810 1,508 —
1820 2,095 38.9%
1830 8,668 313.7%
1840 18,213 110.1%
1850 42,261 132.0%
1860 81,129 92.0%
1870 117,714 45.1%
1880 155,134 31.8%
1890 255,664 64.8%
1900 352,387 37.8%
1910 423,715 20.2%
1920 506,775 19.6%
1930 573,076 13.1%
1940 575,901 0.5%
1950 580,132 0.7%
1960 532,759 −8.2%
1970 462,768 −13.1%
1980 357,870 −22.7%
1990 328,123 −8.3%
2000 292,648 −10.8%
2010 261,310 −10.7%

So looking at the above Buffalo should cease to exist by 2050 , WG just playing the long game..

Ok I'll play along.

Chicago has far more Italians than Buffalo (about 500,000) and it's down to about 15 made members. Using the same math, i.e. dividing by 50% for males and subtracting 24% for under 18, that means the Chicago mob is .00007 of the available Italian male population.

The New York metropolitan area of course is the largest with 2.6 million. About 700 members for the 5 families. Again, divide by 50%, subtract another 24%, and the NY families have .0007 of the available Italian male population.

But Buffalo, with its available Italian male population of 11,400 and using the same breakdown has a bigger percentage of .0026 with its 30 members than either New York or Chicago?

Another

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Thirty members that could be spread throughout Buffalo, Niagara Falls, Utica, Rochester, Toronto, and Hamilton. Not including other outlying towns that historically had members. Even one member in an outlying city is significant when we're splitting hairs about a ~30 member family.

Rochester? Utica? Seriously?

I realize you guys need to find a way to explain two-thirds of this 30+ member family being unaccounted for (show me one other family in the U.S. you can say that about) but you're really reaching.

To be fair, if you throw in Hamilton (with its available Italian male population of maybe 28,000, you get something closer to the New York percentage. But that, in itself, is a problem because the membership of the NY families have remained relatively stable for the past 20+ years. Can't say the same about Buffalo (including Hamilton and its 3 known members).

[CabriniGreen]

Fun facts.

Buffalo has a pop of around 256k. Its Italian % is around 11.7% which equates to almost exactly 30k people of Italian descent.
Around half being male would equal 15k. Under 18yrs old the US % is 24% equating to 11,400 approx males of Italian descent, 18 yrs or older.

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Interesting history on Buffalo's historical population:
1810 1,508 —
1820 2,095 38.9%
1830 8,668 313.7%
1840 18,213 110.1%
1850 42,261 132.0%
1860 81,129 92.0%
1870 117,714 45.1%
1880 155,134 31.8%
1890 255,664 64.8%
1900 352,387 37.8%
1910 423,715 20.2%
1920 506,775 19.6%
1930 573,076 13.1%
1940 575,901 0.5%
1950 580,132 0.7%
1960 532,759 −8.2%
1970 462,768 −13.1%
1980 357,870 −22.7%
1990 328,123 −8.3%
2000 292,648 −10.8%
2010 261,310 −10.7%

So looking at the above Buffalo should cease to exist by 2050 , WG just playing the long game..

Ok I'll play along.

Chicago has far more Italians than Buffalo (about 500,000) and it's down to about 15 made members. Using the same math, i.e. dividing by 50% for males and subtracting 24% for under 18, that means the Chicago mob is .00007 of the available Italian male population.

The New York metropolitan area of course is the largest with 2.6 million. About 700 members for the 5 families. Again, divide by 50%, subtract another 24%, and the NY families have .0007 of the available Italian male population.

But Buffalo, with its available Italian male population of 11,400 and using the same breakdown has a bigger percentage of .0026 with its 30 members than either New York or Chicago?

Another

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Thirty members that could be spread throughout Buffalo, Niagara Falls, Utica, Rochester, Toronto, and Hamilton. Not including other outlying towns that historically had members. Even one member in an outlying city is significant when we're splitting hairs about a ~30 member family.

Rochester? Utica? Seriously?

I realize you guys need to find a way to explain two-thirds of this 30+ member family being unaccounted for (show me one other family in the U.S. you can say that about) but you're really reaching.

Strange math, lol....

[B.]

Mafia recruitment in WNY and Ontario has never pulled primarily from some mythical "recruitment pool" based on the greater Italian population, but a very specific set of relationships. Todaro Jr. and Violi are both third generation underworld figures. There is still interrelation and many of the relationships among known members are multi-generational.

The Buffalo family has never built its membership the way Chicago, parts of NYC, or New England did. They have always been closer to a family like the DeCavalcantes in how they select members. Not just "recruitment," either, but their entire approach... like Gravano recently said, he found it strange the Buffalo family's MO was basically to induct someone and immediately give them a union position. They don't have the union anymore, at least not the way they used to, but their family likely follows the same patterns of membership it always has, albeit in more limited form. Detroit would be another great comparison as far as "recruitment" goes.

Can't really have a discussion about potential membership if the premise isn't even based on how Buffalo has historically recruited members. Not ancient history either, but we can see it among the confirmed members even today. If it's a question of the "quality" of prospective member's, that's another discussion but you can't leave history out of that, either.

No question Peter Gerace is a loser. But if he's a member, it's because he's Joe Todaro's loser and that matters. People have a tendency to look at the past through rose-colored glasses... read through the Magaddino tapes and you'll see that Stefano Magaddino inducted his loser nephew Joe Bongiorno as a member and got him a job tending bar at a bowling alley. The non-Italian bowling alley manager was a repeat visitor to Magaddino's office and often complained about Bongiorno for, among other things, stealing money from the till when he was on shift. Stefano Magaddino's brother Nino was a made member who Magaddino repeatedly complained about, as Nino Magaddino would get drunk at the bowling alley every night and embarrass himself.

It was a ~100 member organization back then and made a lot more money, but you see a lot of the same trends repeat.

[NothingNew44]

Fun facts.

Buffalo has a pop of around 256k. Its Italian % is around 11.7% which equates to almost exactly 30k people of Italian descent.
Around half being male would equal 15k. Under 18yrs old the US % is 24% equating to 11,400 approx males of Italian descent, 18 yrs or older.

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Interesting history on Buffalo's historical population:
1810 1,508 —
1820 2,095 38.9%
1830 8,668 313.7%
1840 18,213 110.1%
1850 42,261 132.0%
1860 81,129 92.0%
1870 117,714 45.1%
1880 155,134 31.8%
1890 255,664 64.8%
1900 352,387 37.8%
1910 423,715 20.2%
1920 506,775 19.6%
1930 573,076 13.1%
1940 575,901 0.5%
1950 580,132 0.7%
1960 532,759 −8.2%
1970 462,768 −13.1%
1980 357,870 −22.7%
1990 328,123 −8.3%
2000 292,648 −10.8%
2010 261,310 −10.7%

So looking at the above Buffalo should cease to exist by 2050 , WG just playing the long game..

Ok I'll play along.

Chicago has far more Italians than Buffalo (about 500,000) and it's down to about 15 made members. Using the same math, i.e. dividing by 50% for males and subtracting 24% for under 18, that means the Chicago mob is .00007 of the available Italian male population.

The New York metropolitan area of course is the largest with 2.6 million. About 700 members for the 5 families. Again, divide by 50%, subtract another 24%, and the NY families have .0007 of the available Italian male population.

But Buffalo, with its available Italian male population of 11,400 and using the same breakdown has a bigger percentage of .0026 with its 30 members than either New York or Chicago?

Another

Why is believing that the Buffalo family finding THIRTY guys so ludicrous within a pool of eleven and a half THOUSAND?

Thirty members that could be spread throughout Buffalo, Niagara Falls, Utica, Rochester, Toronto, and Hamilton. Not including other outlying towns that historically had members. Even one member in an outlying city is significant when we're splitting hairs about a ~30 member family.

Rochester? Utica? Seriously?

I realize you guys need to find a way to explain two-thirds of this 30+ member family being unaccounted for (show me one other family in the U.S. you can say that about) but you're really reaching.

Strange math, lol....

This is hilarious

[NickleCity]

During the 2005-2009 American Community Survey, the Buffalo-Niagara Falls Metro Area maintained its second highest ranking, with an estimated 195,431 Italians (Appendix 2).

The Rochester Metro Area was home to an estimated 183,773 during the 2005-2009 period (Appendix 2).

Source: https://www.steveacunto.com/italians-in ... 2000-2009/

[calabrianwatch]

‘Ndrangheta Dynamics In The Greater Toronto Area: The Story Of An Internal Mafia Clash (Part 1)

https://bit.ly/3uTnmuZ

This was a great read, very thorough. My only slight problem with it is:

"Due to the repeated arrests listed above, the Society of Siderno lacked a unitary leadership: every 'Ndrina in Siderno as well as every Locale scattered in Italy, Europe and other continents (“it has ninety-six Locali”) was free to act independently, without asking for prior advice or authorization from the top of the mother-Society"

This was always the case, it's not special of that period - the Siderno society has never been hierarchical in the sense of 'authorising' things, it has ALWAYS been particularly conflictual and the 'heads' only solved conflicts, they don't direct anyone's acts! the Costa-Commisso-Macrì fight has been one of the best examples of that. From the 2010-2015 period came a new order which moved the council/society's heads to Ontario from Siderno, precisely because of what Machin says: different people in jail, especially Giuseppe Commisso, means that the highest ranking people were elsewhere. This doesn't mean lack of leadership in Siderno - Siderno is the only Society in the 'ndrangheta that is organised not by 'ndrine and their surname, but by territorial unit within the same Siderno village - it's the only town where you don't just have the 'ndrina Commisso but you also have a street name next to the 'ndrina surname. This means, in practice, that the territory has never been led by leaders, but rather hanged into precarious forms of equilibrium. The strength of the Siderno groups has always been OUTSIDE the Siderno group (and the facts of today prove this too!)

[NickleCity]

During the 2005-2009 American Community Survey, the Buffalo-Niagara Falls Metro Area maintained its second highest ranking, with an estimated 195,431 Italians (Appendix 2).

The Rochester Metro Area was home to an estimated 183,773 during the 2005-2009 period (Appendix 2).

Source: https://www.steveacunto.com/italians-in ... 2000-2009/

Downtown Buffalo to Downtown Rochester is 1hr and 11 minutes. The outlying suburbs and bedroom communities make these cities even closer. The Italian population in these two areas combined is 378,204. IMHO that is a significant pool of people in a relatively small area.

[Angelo Santino]

Actually now that I think about it, Violi only said he beat out 30 guys for promotion. He didn't state that was the entire membership of the Buffalo borgata, only that 30 guys were considered for the position of Underboss. Could it be similar to when Barney beat out 16 captains for boss of the West Side?

Buffalo territory has traditionally extended from Buffalo up into Ontario and down to Niagara Falls to Rochester, Utica, Albany, Binghamton all the way west to Erie, PA. That's 10x the territory that the Genoveses control. If Buffalo is back then Joe Todaro probably has no shortage of people to elevate? Given that since 911 most agents have been reassigned to counter terrorism, it likely gave the Todaros some breathing room to rebuild their organization and make money, not headlines.

[thesociety 89]

@Chris Christie you naughty boy.

[CabriniGreen]

‘Ndrangheta Dynamics In The Greater Toronto Area: The Story Of An Internal Mafia Clash (Part 1)

https://bit.ly/3uTnmuZ

This was a great read, very thorough. My only slight problem with it is:

"Due to the repeated arrests listed above, the Society of Siderno lacked a unitary leadership: every 'Ndrina in Siderno as well as every Locale scattered in Italy, Europe and other continents (“it has ninety-six Locali”) was free to act independently, without asking for prior advice or authorization from the top of the mother-Society"

This was always the case, it's not special of that period - the Siderno society has never been hierarchical in the sense of 'authorising' things, it has ALWAYS been particularly conflictual and the 'heads' only solved conflicts, they don't direct anyone's acts! the Costa-Commisso-Macrì fight has been one of the best examples of that. From the 2010-2015 period came a new order which moved the council/society's heads to Ontario from Siderno, precisely because of what Machin says: different people in jail, especially Giuseppe Commisso, means that the highest ranking people were elsewhere. This doesn't mean lack of leadership in Siderno - Siderno is the only Society in the 'ndrangheta that is organised not by 'ndrine and their surname, but by territorial unit within the same Siderno village - it's the only town where you don't just have the 'ndrina Commisso but you also have a street name next to the 'ndrina surname. This means, in practice, that the territory has never been led by leaders, but rather hanged into precarious forms of equilibrium. The strength of the Siderno groups has always been OUTSIDE the Siderno group (and the facts of today prove this too!)

Honestly, that JUMPED OFF THE PAGE for me.... 96.... Ninety- six locali worldwide.....Jesus Christ, lol.....

[SantoClaus]

Actually now that I think about it, Violi only said he beat out 30 guys for promotion. He didn't state that was the entire membership of the Buffalo borgata, only that 30 guys were considered for the position of Underboss. Could it be similar to when Barney beat out 16 captains for boss of the West Side?

Buffalo territory has traditionally extended from Buffalo up into Ontario and down to Niagara Falls to Rochester, Utica, Albany, Binghamton all the way west to Erie, PA. That's 10x the territory that the Genoveses control. If Buffalo is back then Joe Todaro probably has no shortage of people to elevate? Given that since 911 most agents have been reassigned to counter terrorism, it likely gave the Todaros some breathing room to rebuild their organization and make money, not headlines.

There was a Homeland Security involvement in the solving of the Musitano and Barberi murders, as well as the FBI and DEA. I found that interesting for an OC murder to be solved like that when the typically don’t get solved at all.

https://hamiltonpolice.on.ca/news/suspe ... homicides/

In addition, considering all the other elements related to Buffalo reappearing and Hamilton becoming a war zone, and the Canadian State is allowing Isis trained Canadians to return to Canada. As well as the Canadian government paying out 10 million dollars to an Al Qaeda soldier, that tried to kill Canadians in Afghanistan.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/key-even ... -1.1153759

The mob has been used to protect the Homeland before, maybe that is something, maybe not. I’ll assume that Homeland only gets involved when the Homeland is under threat. Danny Ranieri (who is tied to Joey Bravo- tied to Ray Desjardins) and Michael Cudmore were both found dead in Mexico.

The US Government has certain cartels as terrorist organizations, maybe this is the international link in Canada? If that’s even possible?