THE BLACK HAND FORUM

[quote=TallGuy19 post_id=179881 time=1609861769 user_id=5887]
[quote=AntComello post_id=179669 time=1609677964 user_id=6170]
You think any of those current active guys he’s talking about are getting pissed off and want to at lest give him a beating?? Or is that out of the question in 2021
[/quote]

Attacking a federal witness is probably a bad idea for anyone who wants to stay out of prison. They made a federal case out of John Perna assaulting some random guy, so I can only imagine that some prosecutor looking to make a name for himself would jump at the opportunity to go after a wiseguy for attacking Pennisi.
[/quote]

Good point...I think it would have to be the perfect situation for it to happen

[quote=AntComello post_id=179669 time=1609677964 user_id=6170]
You think any of those current active guys he’s talking about are getting pissed off and want to at lest give him a beating?? Or is that out of the question in 2021
[/quote]

Attacking a federal witness is probably a bad idea for anyone who wants to stay out of prison. They made a federal case out of John Perna assaulting some random guy, so I can only imagine that some prosecutor looking to make a name for himself would jump at the opportunity to go after a wiseguy for attacking Pennisi.

You think any of those current active guys he’s talking about are getting pissed off and want to at lest give him a beating?? Or is that out of the question in 2021

[quote=Ryan98366 post_id=179586 time=1609607270 user_id=5272]
Always great stuff chin_gigante. The problem is Pennisi. He just isn't credible to me. He's a bum.
[/quote]

This guy is a story teller and what he’s doing is dangerous for the people he’s talking About and for himself. I know a lot of people are enjoying the things he’s saying but a lot is fabrication. Some may be true I’m sure... but he has a hell of an imagination. It’s like he comes on the boards and reads what is said then goes and gives people what they want to hear.

GA and anastasia know pretty much fuck all

- Capeci said his source for Licata being consigliere was not Pennisi. Based on that, it's not something Pennisi made up by himself. Capeci also didn't have total faith in his own source's info but nonetheless reported it.

- When Pennisi mentioned Licata was consigliere on the podcast, he immediately followed that by saying Licata was a skipper. This was a verbal interview, so he may have been correcting himself as he spoke. I doubt he was saying Licata was both consigliere and had a decina, though Philly has had that arrangement historically. He could have also meant Licata was a captain and acting consigliere. What's important is that he said Licata was a captain at that time, too, so it's not the first time he's said Licata was a captain.

- No doubt Pennisi has been a bit glib. He is doing a lot of articles, a lot of interviews, and he is obviously listening to other podcasts and reading about the mob online, probably including this board. I doubt he has much in the way of editing, at least not from anyone who is going to correct his info.

Now that he knows his target audience is a horde of fiends who will stab his eyeballs out for saying Scoops' first name is Anthony, maybe he will check his work a little more.

Pennisi isn't doing anything for me in the credibility department, that's for damn sure.

Great summary as always, chin. It once again confirmed my suspicions that Anastasia and Schratwieser theorize as much as people on the forum, but they don't do it for free. I'm not sold on Pennisi either. He provides good discussion material, though.

Always great stuff chin_gigante. The problem is Pennisi. He just isn't credible to me. He's a bum.

[b]I have been thinking about the consigliere position a lot since the indictment hit in November and I've got a tiny bit of new information from my own digging to share so I thought I'd compile everything I have so far.[/b]

***

[quote]During the period covered in the Superseding Indictment, the Philadelphia LCN was led by Street Boss M.L., Underboss defendant STEVEN MAZZONE, and [b]Consigliere J.L.[/b] […] On or about October 15, 2015, defendants STEVEN MAZZONE, DOMENIC GRANDE, and SALVATORE MAZZONE participated in a "making ceremony" in South Philadelphia, during which several new soldiers were inducted into the Philadelphia LCN.[/quote]

United States District Court, Eastern District of Pennsylvania. [i]United States of America v. Steven Mazzone, et al.[/i] 23 November 2020. https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/1339101/download



[quote][b]Joseph "Scoops" Licata[/b] gives his advice and guidance, an old timer from the Angelo Bruno days, who [b]now holds the Consigliere position.[/b][/quote]

Pennisi, John. "Feds: No Philadelphia Freedom For Philly Mob", [i]Sitdown News[/i]. 24 November 2020. https://sitdownnews.com/feds-no-philadelphia-freedom-for-philly-mob/



[quote]GA: This whole thing began with the case against [Joseph] Servidio over in New Jersey. "Joey Electric", who's part of the Newark crew, we're told. He's part of Joe "Scoops" Licata's crew.
[…]
DS: Two initials kind of stick out. Two sets of initials sandwiched around Steve Mazzone in a paragraph in here and it's kind of put neatly in the indictment in the middle here. And that says – identifies the street boss, M.L., Steven Mazzone as the underboss during this time period and the consigliere as J.L.
GA: Right.
DS: Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out who those people are.
GA: In fact, I'm almost surprised that they went that direction. I mean, everybody's gonna know M.L. is probably Michael Lancellotti.
DS: Right.
GA: And there's been other testimony about that.
DS: In New York. In the East Coast LCN case there was testimony that he was introduced at a Christmas party with all the players in there – forty-something people. Joey Merlino allegedly introduces him as his new street boss in Philadelphia and, I'm told, elsewhere made that introduction.
GA: Yes, and that goes back several years. Now [b]J.L., the consigliere, everybody assumes is Joe Ligambi[/b], the retired mob boss.
DS: Right.
GA: I think he chuckles at that and says he's retired, but I think that's what the feds are alleging.[/quote]

Anastasia, George. Interview with Dave Schratwieser. "Philly Prime Podcast 26", [i]Philly Prime Podcast[/i]. 25 November 2020. https://philly-prime-podcast.simplecast.com/episodes/philly-prime-podcast-26



[quote]Sources say that [b]during the ceremony, Mikey Lance introduced Joseph (Scoops) Licata as the crime family's consigliere[/b] to the newly inducted wiseguys, who included Salvatore (Sonny) Mazzone, the underboss's younger brother, who was also hit with racketeering charges.[/quote]

Capeci, Jerry. "Philly Mob Conducted Induction Ceremony For An Unwanted Audience", [i]Gang Land News[/i]. 10 December 2020. https://www.ganglandnews.com/members/column1232.htm



[quote]My sources say it's Licata. [b]When I saw J.L., I assumed it was either Ligambi or Licata and when I checked was told it was Licata[/b]. I don't have a clue how and why Pennisi says the same thing, but [b]I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out that the feds had the wrong initials and it's neither Licata nor Ligambi.[/b][/quote]

Capeci, Jerry. Email exchange with myself. 10 December 2020.



[quote]Obviously, I met Joey Merlino, he's their boss. I met Stevie Mazzone who's their underboss. [b]I met Anthony "Scoops" Licata [sic.] who's their consigliere. He was a skipper. I met Johnny Chang, Johnny Ciancaglini, who is a friend with them.[/b] I met Sonny Mazzone, who was just straightened out, who's Stevie’s brother. And I met Domenic Grande, who is in – you know these guys are in trouble right now – he's a caporegime with them. […] I don't know their numbers. I don't know, you know, I don't know who they have and how many skippers they had. I only met one.[/quote]

Pennisi, John. Interview with Tom La Vecchia. "Italian Mafia Going into 2021 with John Pennisi Part 4", [i]New Theory Podcast[/i]. 13 December 2020. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhBh2aob4to&t=1589s&ab_channel=NewTheoryPodcast



[quote][[i]While discussing Jerry Capeci's article[/i]]
GA: We're still trying to read between the lines and figure it all out but when we saw the M.L. and the J.L. [b]we kind of jumped to a conclusion that the J.L. was Joe Ligambi. It might have been Joe Licata.[/b] Although someone else says it was John Lennon or Jennifer Lopez. [Laughs] You have a lot of different ways to go with this.
DS: That's a defense attorney saying that, right George? I won't guess who it is.
GA: Yes, absolutely.
DS: So yeah, that's the problem with guessing a little bit.[/quote]

Anastasia, George. Interview with Dave Schratwieser. "Philly Prime Podcast 27", [i]Philly Prime Podcast[/i]. 18 December 2020. https://philly-prime-podcast.simplecast.com/episodes/philly-prime-podcast-27



[quote][[i]While discussing John Perna's August 2015 wedding[/i]]
A lot of our borgata was there. Our administration was there. Some guys from the West Side were there. No Philly guys – oh, no, that's not true. Matter of fact, it's good that I bring him up. On the last one we mentioned – when we talked about Philly – I said the wrong name. That Scoops Licata – I said Anthony. Anthony Licata is a friend with the Gambinos, I mixed them up. I guess his name is Joe, [b]I was introduced to him as Scoops, but I had met him at that wedding.[/b] Scoops Licata, that's with the Philly mob. So he was there, there was a guy from Philly there.[/quote]

Pennisi, John. Interview with Tom La Vecchia. "NJ Housewives and The Mob with John Pennisi Part #6", [i]New Theory Podcast[/i]. 19 December 2020. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PwXl1p9eok&t=517s&ab_channel=NewTheoryPodcast



[quote]After having met Joey Merlino, this author took a ride to South Philly to meet the rest of the Merlino crew sometime in early 2016. Driving me there was Joe "Little Joe" Perna, a fellow [friend] member of the Lucchese family. […] We headed to a local diner. It was here that the Philly mob held court. John "Johnny Chang" Ciancaglini, was the first guy we met entering the diner. I had a message for him from Joey Amato, a Colombo caporegime. Perna introduced us as friends and I gave the message. [b]Johnny Chang was a consigliere at that time.[/b][/quote]

Pennisi, John. "Mafia Murders Exposed By Lucchese Wiseguy Joe Perna", [i]Sitdown News[/i]. 01 January 2021. https://sitdownnews.com/exclusive-philly-mafia-murders/



[quote][[i]When asked about identifying both John Ciancaglini and Joseph Licata as the Philadelphia consigliere[/i]]
[b]The Scoops position was a mistake – I was introduced to Scoops as a Caporegime – a captain.[/b][/quote]

Pennisi, John. Email exchange with myself. 01 January 2021.



***

[b]Some thoughts:[/b]

My initial scepticism about J.L. being Licata is returning after Pennisi's latest article and his response to my email. If Capeci is correct (while also keeping in mind he thinks it's possible that law enforcement got the initials wrong) then Licata was consigliere by October 2015. However, we now know from Pennisi that Licata was introduced to him as a caporegime at John Perna's wedding two months prior. Then, John Ciancaglini was introduced to Pennisi as the Philadelphia consigliere in early 2016. If Licata was the consigliere then he could have only been so for a few months.