THE BLACK HAND FORUM

Years ago (70's and before) a successful shylock had hundreds of guys with small knockdown loans that always kept coming back when they knocked the old one down. It was 5 for 6 over 10 weeks. 500 bucks in 1975 was a lot of money, but paying 60 bucks over 10 weeks wasn't gonna kill anybody. If a guy got in too deep with someone, I feel, there was always an end-game. They wanted the guys restaurant, or the guys business or whatever. Mind you that running to the Feds in the 70's was not quite the option it is now.
There were also plenty of situations where wiseguys who were big bookmakers got hit and didn't lay off right for a week or two and went on the street from other wiseguys, but they paid only a point to a point and a half. And the loan got paid because they were all made guys and would get sanctioned if they pulled any bullshit about not paying.
Anybody who gives a regular degenerate in the 10's of thousands of dollars today is just looking to go to jail. Even the low level knucklehead kid who gets SENT to collect the money is in a lot of trouble because the whole thing is now considered a crime of violence.

There are some guys who set up these "factoring companies"....I think most of them are hooked up, not necessarily made, but they lure business guys into signing over parts of their future credit card receiveables or other receiveables to the "lender". The guy lending the money has papers drawn up that in the event of any breach the borrower is in default and the lender gets access to the company bank accounts. There was a story in the papers a while ago where guys were doing this who were hard up for cash, then within a few days the lender lowers the boom and files a suit (for no reason) and freezes the guys account...they run up to Goshen NY where there was a little courthouse friendly to these scumbag lawsuits and the lenders basically took over the companies. Again, you have to be pretty desperate and pretty stupid to allow this to happen to you, but this is the "new" shylocking.

The craziest part is.. the kid I told the story about .. he’s been getting in and out of situations like I told about above since we were 15 years old sneaking into the casinos... to this day. I have hundreds of other hilarious stories but this one I was there for all of it and seeing someone piss away money like that in minutes made me sick to my stomach. Lol I always used to tell him, you’re so glad I like you or else when you were driving home after winning that $116,000 drunk as fuck and blacked out on Xanax you’re lucky I didn’t make that shit mine.

[quote=bert post_id=138344 time=1581747009 user_id=5933]
[quote=chubby post_id=138325 time=1581737754 user_id=4221]
I also feel the same about sports betting and gambling in general. I’ve had friends that were the craziest degenerates I’ve ever seen in my life, worse than any drug junkie I have ever seen with gambling . Yeah it’s the same thing they’re the one seeking out that action to someone who is just merely providing a service.
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Agreed again, on them being junkies in a way, with one difference. Especially with heroin, there are more addicts. Gambling less so. I used to bet occasionally, but like most I keep it under control and casual. The majority of my friends and others I know are the same. Heroin is the other way around, about 90% who got started became addicts. Heroin should never be legal, gambling should be left alone. Also, I rather bet with a reliable bookie than with the state. In England bookies were made legal a long time ago, how close they are monitored I don't know.
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Again I agree. I think it’s safe to say every single person on here has had friends of family members affected by the opiate epidemic... some of us have even played a part in it... it ruins lives end of story. And I’ve seen it enough to know... if you’ve never popped a norco or a perc 30.. literally don’t even try it.. it’s not worth it.. the only thing crazy about gamblers when it comes to their addiction is there is no limit.. like the craziest junkie in the world can only do like $1,000 in dope or pills a day or whatever... but when it comes to gambling that number has no ceiling, you can literally lose millions in a day. A good friend of mine brought $4,500 to the blackjack table one night. Left with $116,000... got invited to an invite only really high stakes poker game ran by some Chinese triads.. he played a few nights.. ended up losing all of it.. the guys who ran the game thought he had more money since he just pissed away 100k like it was nothing so he asked them to spot him , they did and he ended up losing more and owed 70k$ by the end of the night... they gave him a week to pay... did a ton of fraud to try to get a bankroll together to hit the blackjack table to make the money back to pay off the 70k$(that’s the type of logic these degenerates have) anyways he set up a heads up game against a really wealthy guy in poker and he printed up 10 grand in counterfeit just to flash tonthe guy real quick before they started playing (again cause he was so delusional it’s like there was no way he wasn’t going to win so he didn’t have to worry about the fake money, cause I was like dude what happens when you lose and he wants his bread and you have to tell him it’s funny money? What then) well that’s what happened he lost another $5000 and had to tell this dude how he hustles him and was playing with no money to back him. So now he owes 70k tonthe Chinese and 5000 to this guy who says he’s living on my boys couch and not leaving til he gets his 6500.... so the next day same cycle of bank fraud he gets 1500$ together and I drive him to the casino so he can try to win the money back and save his life (he owes the 70k$ this night) so he starts with 1500 at the blackjack table and in about an hour or two he’s up $46,000... so I’m like damn call the Chinese tell them you got 30k cash for them tonight (cause they were expecting 0$ from him, so they would have been ok with 30k, give your other boy the 5k, then hold $11k for yourself so you can try to figure something out.... nah instead he tells me he ain’t leaving unless he walks out with $100k and proceeeds to blow the 46k in a matter of minutes.. some hands he was betting 12k.... he walked out of the casino with like 35$ to his name, in so much stress over the debts he looked like he was honestly going to die... ended up getting his brand new Benz taken by the Chinese... sorry for the rambling.. but just a funny little story about a degenerate at his finest moments.... you can’t get me to even pull the arm of a slot machine...

[quote=chubby post_id=138325 time=1581737754 user_id=4221]
I also feel the same about sports betting and gambling in general. I’ve had friends that were the craziest degenerates I’ve ever seen in my life, worse than any drug junkie I have ever seen with gambling . Yeah it’s the same thing they’re the one seeking out that action to someone who is just merely providing a service.
[/quote]

Agreed again, on them being junkies in a way, with one difference. Especially with heroin, there are more addicts. Gambling less so. I used to bet occasionally, but like most I keep it under control and casual. The majority of my friends and others I know are the same. Heroin is the other way around, about 90% who got started became addicts. Heroin should never be legal, gambling should be left alone. Also, I rather bet with a reliable bookie than with the state. In England bookies were made legal a long time ago, how close they are monitored I don't know.

I also feel the same about sports betting and gambling in general. I’ve had friends that were the craziest degenerates I’ve ever seen in my life, worse than any drug junkie I have ever seen with gambling . Yeah it’s the same thing they’re the one seeking out that action to someone who is just merely providing a service.

[quote=bert post_id=138321 time=1581736643 user_id=5933]
[quote=chubby post_id=138295 time=1581724828 user_id=4221]
Honestly if you willingly borrow money on the street I don’t see that person as being a victim at all... they went to seek out the money on their own and knew who they were borrowing from.. so when they run tonthe feds just cause they don’t want to pay the money back, or can’t .. that’s their own fucking problem in my eyes... I don’t have any sympathy for them whatsoever... they agreed to certain terms and defaulted... in my eyes they are in the wrong .. then the shy ends up losing out on his money and gets sent to prison.. it’s bullshit and the guys who pull that shit are scumbag conmen.
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100% agreed
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Right? And I don’t think this is me being biased or choosing his side based on my morals and beliefs. I honestly just don’t see how anyone could have a valid argument for the other side. If by chance someone did try to justify it They would definitely have an agenda. To me it’s not even debatable.

The thing that gets me is that if you lend person 500 dollars for 600 dollars to be paid over a time period of close to a year, it's legal. However since they usually do it over a 10 week period, it's illegal due to the rate to year ratio. If a bank doesn't get paid, they send the marshalls and police to toss you out of your home, and seize your other property such as a a car. That is no crime and accepted. But if a shylock yells at a guy to start paying him back it's felony extortion.

[quote=chubby post_id=138295 time=1581724828 user_id=4221]
Honestly if you willingly borrow money on the street I don’t see that person as being a victim at all... they went to seek out the money on their own and knew who they were borrowing from.. so when they run tonthe feds just cause they don’t want to pay the money back, or can’t .. that’s their own fucking problem in my eyes... I don’t have any sympathy for them whatsoever... they agreed to certain terms and defaulted... in my eyes they are in the wrong .. then the shy ends up losing out on his money and gets sent to prison.. it’s bullshit and the guys who pull that shit are scumbag conmen.
[/quote]

100% agreed

Honestly if you willingly borrow money on the street I don’t see that person as being a victim at all... they went to seek out the money on their own and knew who they were borrowing from.. so when they run tonthe feds just cause they don’t want to pay the money back, or can’t .. that’s their own fucking problem in my eyes... I don’t have any sympathy for them whatsoever... they agreed to certain terms and defaulted... in my eyes they are in the wrong .. then the shy ends up losing out on his money and gets sent to prison.. it’s bullshit and the guys who pull that shit are scumbag conmen.

And with the 10 checks from a loan customer.. I wonder if they were doing it similar in that jersey west side bust where they were running their shy out of the payday loan spot..

I remember staino and then when they loaned the fbi guy 30k in the cereal box it was a short term loan.. they had some agreement like loaning 30k and in a month or 2 or whatever the guy needed to pay back 35k or some shit like that. They were doing fixed short term loans..

[quote=Stroccos post_id=138260 time=1581707158 user_id=2183]
[quote=bert post_id=138235 time=1581698838 user_id=5933]
It is illegal because the government sets loan rates, if you charge more then the crime is Usury (Shylocking, Loansharking) When you add a threat after a borrower will not pay they add an extortion charge. Banks and credit card companies or other lenders have occasionally in the past gone over the legal rates with compounded interests and other methods.
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The feds wire u up and try to get the lender to threanten u and then there done
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Yes, and now we have cases where the borrower takes the money, then goes to the feds and wants to be wired to get out of paying the money they borrowed back.

[quote=bert post_id=138235 time=1581698838 user_id=5933]
It is illegal because the government sets loan rates, if you charge more then the crime is Usury (Shylocking, Loansharking) When you add a threat after a borrower will not pay they add an extortion charge. Banks and credit card companies or other lenders have occasionally in the past gone over the legal rates with compounded interests and other methods.
[/quote]

The feds wire u up and try to get the lender to threanten u and then there done

Usury law:

https://www.lexisnexis.com/legalnewsroom/commercial/b/contracts-commercial-law/posts/for-purposes-of-new-york-usury-laws-what-fees-or-charges-are-included-in-loan-interest-rates

It is illegal because the government sets loan rates, if you charge more then the crime is Usury (Shylocking, Loansharking) When you add a threat after a borrower will not pay they add an extortion charge. Banks and credit card companies or other lenders have occasionally in the past gone over the legal rates with compounded interests and other methods.