Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

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Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Pogo The Clown » Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:34 am

A lot of those so called "innocents" are career criminals or general scumbags who managed to get jammed up for something they didn't do but got away with a lot more. Call it karmic justice.


Pogo

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Confederate » Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:46 am

You know what Sonny, I understand your point but the reason you and I won't go on and on with the debate is because I don't care if 1 guy out of 100 guys on death row should not be there. Doesn't mean that the one guy is St Peter. It just means that 1 out of 100 should not be on death row. I don't fucking care. I would rather see the 99 other guys die that deserve it. The one guy who should not have been on death row is probably some low life smaller criminal anyway. So again, I just don't care.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by SonnyBlackstein » Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:25 am

Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:46 am "Suffering" may be too strong a word. A lot of prisons, at least in the western world, are way too cushy.
'cushy', Seriously?
Ask anyone whos ever been to prison if its cushy. anyone. ever.
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:46 am And you're "quick ending" presupposes something far worse than anything here isn't waiting for them.
You're imposing your beliefs upon society which isn't exactly separation of church and state.
So considering some believe in a hell and some don't, isn't it wise therefor to ensure with certainty punishment IS meted out IN CASE you're wrong?
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:46 amThe US is the only western country in the world with the death penalty. So every other civilized nation on earth doesn't take crime seriously?
Evidently not.
Dude. Seriously.
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:46 amThe problem I have is with people who are against it even when there is no question.
You can't understand, not agree, but understand, their may be understandable perspectives other than yours?
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:46 amIn fact, the whole innocents being executed is often a smokescreen argument and not the core reason they're against it.
The state sanctioned murder of 117 innocent men (undeniably many more), is not what I, or their families, would call a smokescreen. And yes, there are other reasons to be against it, but this reason is certainly a valid argument on its own.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Wiseguy » Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:46 am

SonnyBlackstein wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:50 pm I'd argue a life time of suffering is worse than a quick ending.
"Suffering" may be too strong a word. A lot of prisons, at least in the western world, are way too cushy. And you're "quick ending" presupposes something far worse than anything here isn't waiting for them.
The US is the only western country in the world with the death penalty. So every other civilized nation on earth doesn't take crime seriously?
Evidently not.
But one which is fixable, as opposed to the other.
The vast majority of convicts, including those on death row, are guilty as sin. I agree that the standard for capital punishment needs to be very high. The problem I have is with people who are against it even when there is no question. In fact, the whole innocents being executed is often a smokescreen argument and not the core reason they're against it. And ironically enough, many of these types are just fine with abortion.
Yeah Im going to stick to my guns on this one. Give me the needle, fuck waking up next to bubba for the next 50 years.
You'd only be "sticking to your guns" if you actually were facing your death by execution. It's easy to say otherwise when you're not.

Anyway, as he often does, Dennis Prager sums this topic up well...

https://youtu.be/8dnVZibrV6g

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by SonnyBlackstein » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:50 pm

Wiseguy wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:24 pm more than enough examples of the worst kinds of crimes out there that warrant nothing less.
I'd argue a life time of suffering is worse than a quick ending.
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:24 pmAnd a society measures how seriously it takes a crime by the punishment it gives for it.
The US is the only western country in the world with the death penalty. So every other civilized nation on earth doesn't take crime seriously?
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:24 pmAnd life in prison is a travesty of justice in some cases.
But one which is fixable, as opposed to the other.
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:24 pmAnd the only people who say they'd rather take the needle than life in prison are not facing either. It's why you see so many who are plea bargain to avoid the death penalty but get life in prison.
Yeah Im going to stick to my guns on this one. Give me the needle, fuck waking up next to bubba for the next 50 years.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Wiseguy » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:24 pm

One can make the argument that the standard of proof needs to be very high to get the death penalty but there's more than enough examples of the worst kinds of crimes out there that warrant nothing less. And a society measures how seriously it takes a crime by the punishment it gives for it. And life in prison is a travesty of justice in some cases. And the only people who say they'd rather take the needle than life in prison are not facing either. It's why you see so many who are plea bargain to avoid the death penalty but get life in prison.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Confederate » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:08 pm

The Authors are only giving their opinion about the 4% figure. The 1.6% figure might be more accurate but that is only ONE liberal study and I simply don't care whether it's 1 tenth of 1 % or 1.6 % which sounds cold hearted. Besides, I would rather die than spend my whole life in prison so I'm with you. LOL

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by SonnyBlackstein » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:55 pm

Confederate wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:35 pmThe Death Penalty is probably 99.99 percent accurate so that's good enough for me.
"More than 4 percent of inmates sentenced to death in the United States are probably innocent...reviewed the outcomes of the 7,482 death sentences handed down from 1973 to 2004. Of that group, 117, or 1.6 percent, were exonerated....But with enough time and resources, the authors concluded that at least 4.1 percent of death row inmates would have been exonerated"

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/inno ... _n_5228854

So youre looking at close to 500 men who've been murdered by the state who were innocent. 500.
Thats a small town.

So we're not dealing with the odd tragic injustice here. 500 innocent lives, to me, isnt worth it.

But you're right, we're probably not going to agree.

Personally though, given the choice of spending the rest of my life behind bars and dying in a prison hospital or getting the needle, give me the needle.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Confederate » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:35 pm

SonnyBlackstein wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:27 pm
Confederate wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:11 pm Can't start eliminating everything because of that philosophy. If that were the case, then we should eliminate all forms of punishment for the sake of the 1 tenth of 1% where there was POSSIBLY a mistake.
Nope. Because in those other circumstances the mistake can be corrected.
Can't rectify mistakes with the DP.
The Death Penalty is probably 99.99 percent accurate so that's good enough for me. We'll probably never agree on this subject so I respect your opinion on it but I just don't care about the 1 of 10,000 chance it may be wrong. Nothing is perfect and all the good that comes out of it far outways any rare mistake. Chances are that 1 guy out of 10,000 is a criminal on a smaller scale anyways.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by SonnyBlackstein » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:27 pm

Confederate wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:11 pm Can't start eliminating everything because of that philosophy. If that were the case, then we should eliminate all forms of punishment for the sake of the 1 tenth of 1% where there was POSSIBLY a mistake.
Nope. Because in those other circumstances the mistake can be corrected.
Can't rectify mistakes with the DP.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Confederate » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:11 pm

SonnyBlackstein wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:42 pm
Confederate wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:33 pm
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:06 pm I've always said we need faaaaar more severe penalties in this country for crime, including animal abuse. For instance, I would have no problem whatsoever with people who are involved in dog fighting in any way getting 20 years without parole on their first offense. But this doesn't happen because of an apathetic public, incompetent judges, and lazy prosecutors who are too quick to accept a plea deal.
Should have the death penalty in EVERY State. Some snowflakes argue that it doesn't deter crime, but they are crazy because it DOES deter crime to a certain degree AND it gets RID of at least some of the assholes who are put to death so they CAN'T commit the same crime again plus it saves the taxpayers a lot of money. Sounds like a good deal to me. :D
Except when an innocent man gets the needle.

Not a great deal then.
The Death Penalty should be for EXTREME CASES ONLY. Nothing is perfect. Can't start eliminating everything because of that philosophy. If that were the case, then we should eliminate all forms of punishment for the sake of the 1 tenth of 1% where there was POSSIBLY a mistake. Very rare where there is a mistake in extreme cases like Charles Manson, Ted Bundy etc. etc. 99.99 percent accurate. Again, nothing is perfect.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by SonnyBlackstein » Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:42 pm

Confederate wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:33 pm
Wiseguy wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:06 pm I've always said we need faaaaar more severe penalties in this country for crime, including animal abuse. For instance, I would have no problem whatsoever with people who are involved in dog fighting in any way getting 20 years without parole on their first offense. But this doesn't happen because of an apathetic public, incompetent judges, and lazy prosecutors who are too quick to accept a plea deal.
Should have the death penalty in EVERY State. Some snowflakes argue that it doesn't deter crime, but they are crazy because it DOES deter crime to a certain degree AND it gets RID of at least some of the assholes who are put to death so they CAN'T commit the same crime again plus it saves the taxpayers a lot of money. Sounds like a good deal to me. :D
Except when an innocent man gets the needle.

Not a great deal then.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Confederate » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:33 pm

Wiseguy wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:06 pm I've always said we need faaaaar more severe penalties in this country for crime, including animal abuse. For instance, I would have no problem whatsoever with people who are involved in dog fighting in any way getting 20 years without parole on their first offense. But this doesn't happen because of an apathetic public, incompetent judges, and lazy prosecutors who are too quick to accept a plea deal.
Should have the death penalty in EVERY State. Some snowflakes argue that it doesn't deter crime, but they are crazy because it DOES deter crime to a certain degree AND it gets RID of at least some of the assholes who are put to death so they CAN'T commit the same crime again plus it saves the taxpayers a lot of money. Sounds like a good deal to me. :D

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by SILENT PARTNERZ » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:20 pm

Wiseguy wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:06 pm I've always said we need faaaaar more severe penalties in this country for crime, including animal abuse. For instance, I would have no problem whatsoever with people who are involved in dog fighting in any way getting 20 years without parole on their first offense. But this doesn't happen because of an apathetic public, incompetent judges, and lazy prosecutors who are too quick to accept a plea deal.
I agree. Puppy mills and chaining dogs to trees and leaving them there
to starve, neglected. Sinful.

Re: Falcone/Garcia now working to expose animal abuse?

by Wiseguy » Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:06 pm

I've always said we need faaaaar more severe penalties in this country for crime, including animal abuse. For instance, I would have no problem whatsoever with people who are involved in dog fighting in any way getting 20 years without parole on their first offense. But this doesn't happen because of an apathetic public, incompetent judges, and lazy prosecutors who are too quick to accept a plea deal.

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