THE BLACK HAND FORUM

B. wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2024 9:17 am No clue. It was either shortly before he left Sicily or shortly after he returned which are both interesting.

In terms of the timeline, Baff was hit in November of 1914, while Dragna had arrived in the US in the spring of that year. If he was made in Sicily, then he was already made by the time the Baff thing went down, and, conversely, if it were actually the case that he made his bones on the Baff thing than obviously he wasn’t made over there.

I don’t recall that any of the LA member sources stated where he was made, unless I’m forgetting something.

No clue. It was either shortly before he left Sicily or shortly after he returned which are both interesting.

B. wrote: ↑Fri Jul 26, 2024 10:27 pm Good connection.

Fratianno said Dragna told him he was made in 1914. Same year as the Baff murder so maybe it was how Dragna "made his bones" if he was made shortly after the murder or he was a recent inductee. 1914 was also when he returned to the US from Corleone. Big year for the guy.

Is it known if he was made here or “on the other side”?

Good connection.

Fratianno said Dragna told him he was made in 1914. Same year as the Baff murder so maybe it was how Dragna "made his bones" if he was made shortly after the murder or he was a recent inductee. 1914 was also when he returned to the US from Corleone. Big year for the guy.

Anthony “Tony Nino” Saita was involved in bombing poultry magnet Barnet Baff.

This was not really successful. Later, on Nov 24 1914, he was murdered in a complex operation orchestrated by Ippolito Greco. It also had some very big future players, Lucchese boss Tom Reina & LA boss Jack Dragna.

Saita wasn’t the focus of the investigation following this affair, by then, he had already absconded to Buffalo, NY. However, he was identified by rat Joseph Sorro by his name, nickname, and address:



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Saita was very close to Moretti early on. Considering that he had essentially the same path of East Harlem -> Buffalo -> New Jersey, this makes sense.

Saita was a Sicilian (later claimed to be born in NJ) and would have fit in with the Morello group. He was probably an associate; Greco/Reina/Dragna would have been made.

The reference to Davie Petillo is not out of place either as a later source said Petillo had been straightened out by Capone in Chicago and I believe you found he had relatives there. He wouldn't have been a transfer, but a member of Capone's Genovese crew who simply returned to NYC and stayed with the Genovese.

This is two articles now that discuss the relationship between Didato and Luciano so I'm more confident there was history there along with the other factors discussed.

Here’s another interesting thing that the Times published following Terry Burns’ murder, claiming that DiDato and Luciano had travelled to Chicago together:



As B noted, if the DiDatos were in fact responsible for bringing Luciano in, it would fit the pattern of guys from Eastern Palermo province that we see so strongly with the early Genovese Family.

Baucina adjoins Ventimiglia and Ciminna, and these were also influential comuni in Chicago. Joel has noted that “Dick Terry” DiDato’s mother was a Milianta. This caught my eye as there were intermarried DiDatos and Miliantas in Chicago from Ventimiglia. Milianta is an uncommon surname and is practically only found in Ventimiglia, so there is, IMO, a good chance that the NYC DiDatos may have had relatives in Chicago.

I never realized that Frank Costello was Moretti’s best man. I knew that they were close, just hadn’t heard that detail before:

Newspapers would (and still do) publish bullshit but that's an interesting claim about Luciano starting out around Didato. We don't know who initially brought Luciano into the Family but as discussed in other threads there is a pattern of guys from Lercara Friddi in the Family and it's close to Baucina where the Didatos were from. Luciano was also close to Gambino members Joe Biondo and Steve Armone early on and Didato was close to that Gambino faction as well, Biondo's friends being used to set up and kill Didato.

Given Didato was with the Genovese and his namesake cousin was with the Luccheses, it could suggest the Didatos go back to the Morello Family. Baucinesi like Nino Cecala were important in that Family and of course Baucina is part of that interior Palermo network that provided the foundation of the Family.

If Luciano came up under or alongside Didato it would make sense why the latter felt entitled to take over when Luciano went away.

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For the acting admin, it's frustrating because we have a made member who cooperated and was in the Family for over 30 years spanning this time but many details are unclear.

The admin as of 1932 after Pollaccia's murder:

Boss - Luciano
Underboss - Genovese
Consigliere - Costello

Luciano keeps his title in prison and possibly for a period after his deportation, with Genovese, "Gusae", Moretti, and Costello all named as acting bosses beginning in the mid-1930s and continuing over a decade when Costello becomes official.

Genovese keeps his title too and we have Moretti as a likely acting underboss, but he may have first been acting boss according to Valachi and if he was acting underboss we don't know if it was continuous the entire time Genovese was away.

Was Costello official consigliere the entire time he was acting boss? Pandolfo serves as consigliere and would have represented the Genovese faction on the admin but we don't know when this started and if it was acting or official then he dies in the late 1940s. Nobody that we know of is named as consigliere between Pandolfo's death and Miranda stepping up in the late 1950s, Costello being official boss and no longer consigliere during that time. The Colombos went 5 years without an official consigliere between 1959 and 1964 but in this case it's around a ten year gap for the Genovese and the Colombos did have acting consiglieri during their gap. I've outlined circumstantial evidence before that suggests Del Duca might have been serving in a consigliere capacity but it isn't confirmed.

Easier than pre-1956 Chicago Family at least.

Brovelli wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2024 8:05 am

chin_gigante wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2024 3:54 am

B. wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2024 4:10 pm Along with Moretti probably being acting underboss in Genovese's absence (I'm forgetting if that was ever said outright)

Bill Bonanno appears to be the closest anyone's got to explicitly identifying Moretti as being the acting underboss of the family. There's a chart in The Last Testament of Bill Bonanno of the Genovese administration and Moretti's listed as sottocapo but with an asterix that explains: 'Moretti was not given these official titles, but acted in these roles.'

However I'm not 100% sold on whether Moretti actually held the position (an 'official' acting underboss if you will) or if it was a de facto role, as Bill Bonanno also states:

While Genovese was in Italy, Moretti's influence was elevated in the family. He was looked upon by the other family members as Costello's eyes and ears, like a sotto capo without the title. His influence diminished when Genovese returned and was appointed sotto capo - and that did not sit well with Moretti.

Do we know who was or is generally considered the underboss whilst Genovese was in Italy? Or is that what you’re referring to with moretti being acting for Genovese?

Moretti is generally considered the UB during this period, but as Chin pointed out, this isn’t truly confirmed.

To play devils advocate for this theory: John “Duke” DeNoia was supposed to be his acting capo during this period. He could have held this role during Moretti’s long stays in California.

chin_gigante wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2024 3:54 am

B. wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2024 4:10 pm Along with Moretti probably being acting underboss in Genovese's absence (I'm forgetting if that was ever said outright)

Bill Bonanno appears to be the closest anyone's got to explicitly identifying Moretti as being the acting underboss of the family. There's a chart in The Last Testament of Bill Bonanno of the Genovese administration and Moretti's listed as sottocapo but with an asterix that explains: 'Moretti was not given these official titles, but acted in these roles.'

However I'm not 100% sold on whether Moretti actually held the position (an 'official' acting underboss if you will) or if it was a de facto role, as Bill Bonanno also states:

While Genovese was in Italy, Moretti's influence was elevated in the family. He was looked upon by the other family members as Costello's eyes and ears, like a sotto capo without the title. His influence diminished when Genovese returned and was appointed sotto capo - and that did not sit well with Moretti.

Do we know who was or is generally considered the underboss whilst Genovese was in Italy? Or is that what you’re referring to with moretti being acting for Genovese?

B. wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2024 4:10 pm Along with Moretti probably being acting underboss in Genovese's absence (I'm forgetting if that was ever said outright)

Bill Bonanno appears to be the closest anyone's got to explicitly identifying Moretti as being the acting underboss of the family. There's a chart in The Last Testament of Bill Bonanno of the Genovese administration and Moretti's listed as sottocapo but with an asterix that explains: 'Moretti was not given these official titles, but acted in these roles.'

However I'm not 100% sold on whether Moretti actually held the position (an 'official' acting underboss if you will) or if it was a de facto role, as Bill Bonanno also states:

While Genovese was in Italy, Moretti's influence was elevated in the family. He was looked upon by the other family members as Costello's eyes and ears, like a sotto capo without the title. His influence diminished when Genovese returned and was appointed sotto capo - and that did not sit well with Moretti.

B. wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2024 4:10 pm Another name in the mix around that time is Terry Didato who according to Gentile was undermining Genovese and campaigning to become acting boss or boss himself before his murder. Don't know if Didato was a captain or influential soldier, but there may have been other acting admin positions open given everything was in flux, with not only Costello and Genovese but also Moretti, Didato, and "Gusae" all having stature at the upper rungs of the Family.

Dominick “Terry Burns” DiDato is a fascinating figure

In addition to a bid on narcotics charges; he was arrested with Abe Silverstein for helping Gerald Chapman(the first "Public Enemy Number One") break out of prison. He vanished after his cousin & BIL Dominick “Dick Terry” DiDato was killed in 1933, resurfacing in 1936.

However, the most interesting thing is what some papers said after his death: “Luciano got his start with Burns”


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While there was a chance that the paper just made this up because Luciano had been in the news, it makes sense logistically:

- Burns was a Lower East Side dope guy with close ties to Jewish mobsters. That fits Luciano’s profile to a tee.

- If his family was connected, which was likely, he would have been in a prime position to recuit Luciano into the LCN. He even lived at 80 Stanton St, NYC, NY which was ~10 minutes away from Lucky’s home at 265 East 10th St, NYC, NY

- He had enough clout to try and make a power play. I don’t know what the timeline was exactly on Thomas “Tommy Palmer” Greco taking over Lucky’s crew; it’s possible that Burns could have been capo at the time

I was also going off the quote from the Valachi Papers where he says Genovese started by drumming up gossip among Bender's decina to get people used to the idea that Moretti's condition was a liability. I always like to compare what Valachi said in testimony vs. Valachi Papers vs. Real Thing vs. FBI interviews. Usually he is consistent but sometimes adds different details or context.

Along with Moretti probably being acting underboss in Genovese's absence (I'm forgetting if that was ever said outright), Valachi said in the Real Thing that Moretti was even the acting boss for a time when Luciano first went away and then Costello became acting boss. Genovese fell back into his underboss role when he returned but on a de facto level Moretti was on the same playing field possibly going back to the mid-30s.

The acting boss position though is where Valachi's account gets confusing and possibly inconsistent. In other accounts, he says "Chee Gusae/Gusage" (ph, also transcribed as "Sheik" in one account) was acting boss when Luciano left but died. He also says in one account that Luciano was official boss into the early 1950s and Costello was only acting up to that point, while otherwise it's said to have been the 1940s. So I don't know what to make of Moretti being explicitly named as acting boss before Costello or how that fits / doesn't fit with our boy "Chee". Another name in the mix around that time is Terry Didato who according to Gentile was undermining Genovese and campaigning to become acting boss or boss himself before his murder. Don't know if Didato was a captain or influential soldier, but there may have been other acting admin positions open given everything was in flux, with not only Costello and Genovese but also Moretti, Didato, and "Gusae" all having stature at the upper rungs of the Family.

B. wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2024 10:20 pm Genovese started by floating the Moretti issue among the Strollo crew (of which Valachi was a major part) to get the idea out there, knowing the gossip would spread and help build the case to kill Moretti.

Here’s the part where Valachi discusses this:



A couple of points:

- The agitation against Moretti seems to have started earlier than I realized. ‘49 was before the Keffauver hearings, Bompensiero’s promotion, or Mangano’s disappearance.

- Moretti being perceived blocking Genovese’s rise to power is interesting. This wouldn’t have been true in an official sense, as Genovese appears to have stepped back into his position as Underboss. Racket-wise, there wasn’t much of an overlap.

B. wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2024 10:20 pmIt is an odd coincidence if nothing else that the LA leadership had existing issues with Costello and were assigned to Genovese's ally Lucchese who helped put the final nail in the coffin after they reported the conversation w/ Col White.

I wonder what was Moretti’s interactions with the LA family during his time in the area. On Costello’s phone tap, he mentions meeting Bugsy Siegel but doesn’t really talk about Dragna or any other mafioso

An intriguing figure in this mix would be Joe Sica. He’s supposed to have come up under Moretti (even though he was from Newark’s first ward - Richie Boiardo’s territory), lived in LA, and later gets identified as a Lucchese member