THE BLACK HAND FORUM

funkster wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 7:34 pm Thats right, believe there was talk of him hanging at the hardware store.

funkster wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 4:40 pm Not sure, but i wouldn't be surprised if he did. He's still locked up isnt' he?

Interesting note from Patrick, there was speculation that Bellavia would retire which i was skeptical of. Have you heard anything further of what he may having going on?

funkster wrote: ↑Tue Sep 26, 2023 5:56 pm

PolackTony wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:34 pm

funkster wrote: ↑Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:49 am Holy shit is the first time I’ve seen this video lmao. He’s even busting out the “Moe’s”.

Incidentally he’s reppin Ohio and leavitt which is exactly where Paulie Koruluks house is.

OL is the original chapter and “motherland” for the Notes, so they all rep OL at that level even if they belong to another section.

Sure, just pointing out that PK's house is literally right there lol.

Lot of those weird massage shops in the Ogden/Grand area too. Once saw one getting raided by what I assume was CPD vice while walking down Grand to go to dinner.

PolackTony wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:34 pm

funkster wrote: ↑Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:49 am Holy shit is the first time I’ve seen this video lmao. He’s even busting out the “Moe’s”.

Incidentally he’s reppin Ohio and leavitt which is exactly where Paulie Koruluks house is.

OL is the original chapter and “motherland” for the Notes, so they all rep OL at that level even if they belong to another section.

Patrickgold wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:58 pm

cavita wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 1:56 pm

Snakes wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:53 pm

SonnyC wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:46 pm

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 7:45 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 6:58 am

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:58 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:39 am So where is the present day Outfit most active? The territories for the various crews, if they are even really defined (and I'm sure there's overlap even if they are). I saw some examples of where they're most active now on Reddit and all the places I looked up were way the fuck out the suburbs, I'm talking like the second or third layer of suburbs starting toward the periphery or even just outside of Cook County and continuing further outward for the most part. Like the "Cicero Crew" today is in reality more like the "several miles west of Cicero Crew." Is that really accurate?

Unless one knows firsthand, it is difficult to say. Most of the activity associated with the Sarno indictment was located around the Cicero-Berwyn area with some of the offenses occurring in suburbs further out. However, most indictments since the early 90s also concerned activity in that same area, so this isn't anything new. Around that time, the North Side and Heights crews ceased to exist and rackets in those respective areas dried up. I'd say that most present-day operations exist in the Cicero-Berwyn-Melrose Park area, extending out into neighboring suburbs. There are probably still presences in the city-proper -- particularly the Southside and West Chicago, but unless we receive accurate information to the contrary, it isn't to the same extent as the western suburbs.

Thanks, Snakes. Could you name some of the other suburbs besides the three you mentioned where they're active?

I just checked a map and those three are clustered closer together than I thought, with Elmwood Park not that far away either.

The present-day Outfit seems tiny compared to say 50 years ago.

That's because they are. They have always had a strong presence in the western suburbs going back to Al Capone. Cicero, Berwyn, Melrose Park, Franklin Park, Oak Park, Maywood, etc.

The Sarno indictment mentioned several locations where defendants met or crimes were committed, including:

Berwyn
Cicero
Justice
Hickory Hills
St. Charles
Hinsdale
LaGrange Park

Recent court documents also indicate an Outfit presence still remains in Elmwood Park.

Is there still a big presence in Addison?

I couldn't tell you; some of the guys here do and have some knowledge about areas which still have a strong connection. I can pretty much only go on what I see in official docs

I have to head to the Addison area in a couple months...I'll keep everyone posted. LOL

Go to Venutis on a Saturday night. You will probably see some people there

cavita wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 1:56 pm

Snakes wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:53 pm

SonnyC wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:46 pm

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 7:45 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 6:58 am

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:58 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:39 am So where is the present day Outfit most active? The territories for the various crews, if they are even really defined (and I'm sure there's overlap even if they are). I saw some examples of where they're most active now on Reddit and all the places I looked up were way the fuck out the suburbs, I'm talking like the second or third layer of suburbs starting toward the periphery or even just outside of Cook County and continuing further outward for the most part. Like the "Cicero Crew" today is in reality more like the "several miles west of Cicero Crew." Is that really accurate?

Unless one knows firsthand, it is difficult to say. Most of the activity associated with the Sarno indictment was located around the Cicero-Berwyn area with some of the offenses occurring in suburbs further out. However, most indictments since the early 90s also concerned activity in that same area, so this isn't anything new. Around that time, the North Side and Heights crews ceased to exist and rackets in those respective areas dried up. I'd say that most present-day operations exist in the Cicero-Berwyn-Melrose Park area, extending out into neighboring suburbs. There are probably still presences in the city-proper -- particularly the Southside and West Chicago, but unless we receive accurate information to the contrary, it isn't to the same extent as the western suburbs.

Thanks, Snakes. Could you name some of the other suburbs besides the three you mentioned where they're active?

I just checked a map and those three are clustered closer together than I thought, with Elmwood Park not that far away either.

The present-day Outfit seems tiny compared to say 50 years ago.

That's because they are. They have always had a strong presence in the western suburbs going back to Al Capone. Cicero, Berwyn, Melrose Park, Franklin Park, Oak Park, Maywood, etc.

The Sarno indictment mentioned several locations where defendants met or crimes were committed, including:

Berwyn
Cicero
Justice
Hickory Hills
St. Charles
Hinsdale
LaGrange Park

Recent court documents also indicate an Outfit presence still remains in Elmwood Park.

Is there still a big presence in Addison?

I couldn't tell you; some of the guys here do and have some knowledge about areas which still have a strong connection. I can pretty much only go on what I see in official docs

I have to head to the Addison area in a couple months...I'll keep everyone posted. LOL

SonnyC wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:46 pm

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 7:45 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 6:58 am

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:58 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:39 am So where is the present day Outfit most active? The territories for the various crews, if they are even really defined (and I'm sure there's overlap even if they are). I saw some examples of where they're most active now on Reddit and all the places I looked up were way the fuck out the suburbs, I'm talking like the second or third layer of suburbs starting toward the periphery or even just outside of Cook County and continuing further outward for the most part. Like the "Cicero Crew" today is in reality more like the "several miles west of Cicero Crew." Is that really accurate?

Unless one knows firsthand, it is difficult to say. Most of the activity associated with the Sarno indictment was located around the Cicero-Berwyn area with some of the offenses occurring in suburbs further out. However, most indictments since the early 90s also concerned activity in that same area, so this isn't anything new. Around that time, the North Side and Heights crews ceased to exist and rackets in those respective areas dried up. I'd say that most present-day operations exist in the Cicero-Berwyn-Melrose Park area, extending out into neighboring suburbs. There are probably still presences in the city-proper -- particularly the Southside and West Chicago, but unless we receive accurate information to the contrary, it isn't to the same extent as the western suburbs.

Thanks, Snakes. Could you name some of the other suburbs besides the three you mentioned where they're active?

I just checked a map and those three are clustered closer together than I thought, with Elmwood Park not that far away either.

The present-day Outfit seems tiny compared to say 50 years ago.

That's because they are. They have always had a strong presence in the western suburbs going back to Al Capone. Cicero, Berwyn, Melrose Park, Franklin Park, Oak Park, Maywood, etc.

The Sarno indictment mentioned several locations where defendants met or crimes were committed, including:

Berwyn
Cicero
Justice
Hickory Hills
St. Charles
Hinsdale
LaGrange Park

Recent court documents also indicate an Outfit presence still remains in Elmwood Park.

Is there still a big presence in Addison?

PolackTony wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:38 pm

Patrickgold wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2023 8:29 pm

Ciro_DiMarzio wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2023 12:09 pm

PolackTony wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 11:01 am There aren’t many Italians in the City and haven’t been for decades, apart from the pockets that remained in Armour Square and Grand Ave (with the latter being displaced since the 90s by heavy gentrification, which has mainly erased the longstanding Italian character of the neighborhood).

Great post Tony.

I remember when Italy won Euro 2020 and I saw videos on youtube of the celebrations and it was all still on Harlem Ave. There's some juice head who keeps dropping gang signs and yelling "C note or C nothing". Around 15:30 part

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUYraMcsInU&t=1874s

What are the odds he's active in the gang or just talking shit?

He’s an Addison guy

You mean as in Addison the town, or the Addison and Harlem C-Notes section (not sure if AH is still an active section today)?

Patrickgold wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2023 8:29 pm

Ciro_DiMarzio wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2023 12:09 pm

PolackTony wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 11:01 am There aren’t many Italians in the City and haven’t been for decades, apart from the pockets that remained in Armour Square and Grand Ave (with the latter being displaced since the 90s by heavy gentrification, which has mainly erased the longstanding Italian character of the neighborhood).

Great post Tony.

I remember when Italy won Euro 2020 and I saw videos on youtube of the celebrations and it was all still on Harlem Ave. There's some juice head who keeps dropping gang signs and yelling "C note or C nothing". Around 15:30 part

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUYraMcsInU&t=1874s

What are the odds he's active in the gang or just talking shit?

He’s an Addison guy

funkster wrote: ↑Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:49 am Holy shit is the first time I’ve seen this video lmao. He’s even busting out the “Moe’s”.

Incidentally he’s reppin Ohio and leavitt which is exactly where Paulie Koruluks house is.

Snakes wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:53 pm

SonnyC wrote: ↑Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:46 pm

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 7:45 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 6:58 am

Snakes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:58 am

Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 5:39 am So where is the present day Outfit most active? The territories for the various crews, if they are even really defined (and I'm sure there's overlap even if they are). I saw some examples of where they're most active now on Reddit and all the places I looked up were way the fuck out the suburbs, I'm talking like the second or third layer of suburbs starting toward the periphery or even just outside of Cook County and continuing further outward for the most part. Like the "Cicero Crew" today is in reality more like the "several miles west of Cicero Crew." Is that really accurate?

Unless one knows firsthand, it is difficult to say. Most of the activity associated with the Sarno indictment was located around the Cicero-Berwyn area with some of the offenses occurring in suburbs further out. However, most indictments since the early 90s also concerned activity in that same area, so this isn't anything new. Around that time, the North Side and Heights crews ceased to exist and rackets in those respective areas dried up. I'd say that most present-day operations exist in the Cicero-Berwyn-Melrose Park area, extending out into neighboring suburbs. There are probably still presences in the city-proper -- particularly the Southside and West Chicago, but unless we receive accurate information to the contrary, it isn't to the same extent as the western suburbs.

Thanks, Snakes. Could you name some of the other suburbs besides the three you mentioned where they're active?

I just checked a map and those three are clustered closer together than I thought, with Elmwood Park not that far away either.

The present-day Outfit seems tiny compared to say 50 years ago.

That's because they are. They have always had a strong presence in the western suburbs going back to Al Capone. Cicero, Berwyn, Melrose Park, Franklin Park, Oak Park, Maywood, etc.

The Sarno indictment mentioned several locations where defendants met or crimes were committed, including:

Berwyn
Cicero
Justice
Hickory Hills
St. Charles
Hinsdale
LaGrange Park

Recent court documents also indicate an Outfit presence still remains in Elmwood Park.

Is there still a big presence in Addison?

I couldn't tell you; some of the guys here do and have some knowledge about areas which still have a strong connection. I can pretty much only go on what I see in official docs