THE BLACK HAND FORUM

by **Ivan** » Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:10 am

newera_212 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 9:23 am Things like this kind of normalize the Genovese a little bit - I like it

If you haven't already, read the D'Urso saga if you want to see the Genovese family brought down to earth a bit. It's like reading about the Stanfa mob only with way more money and power.

by **TommyNoto** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 10:26 am

The big Egyptian NJ contractor involved in Senator Menedez bribery case was a associate of Tona Borelli NJ port crew. I wonder what union they needed help with?

It looks the like port crew made was a key player on the NJ Gold Coast real estate boom. Looks like Edgewater is a corrupt town and it’s super rich.

West side port crew is likely up there as top crew in Westside after 116. There is so much less LE and no one is going away for any non violent crime. It’s why we haven’t seen any NJ gambling busts in years, their sports book volume and profit is probably at alll time highs

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fred-daib ... ime-family

by **GaspipeCasso** » Wed Sep 20, 2023 9:53 am

I was wondering if Barney is close to his cousin?

by **jmack** » Tue Sep 19, 2023 7:11 am

AntComello wrote: ↑Tue Sep 19, 2023 5:13 am
Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 4:35 pm
jmack wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 2:05 pm
Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:58 pm Also interesting, a small blip but it had to do with thinking cirillo son was buried at a construction site Basciano had some control over…so who really did that kid?
Oh boy, you’re going to start a whole debate here…
I know. Been debated for years. I still think gun to my head it was vinny on the sneak. Maybe dominick doesnt even know. Its very serious. Reminds me of gotti on tapes saying “prolly the cops killed this paul.” He doesnt even admit in front of ppl that were in the plot intimately. It was so secret they didnt even talk about it. I dont think Cirillo kills his own kid over it.
Also if Vinny Jr is really made maybe that’s why. Made his bones killing the cirillo kid lol

I can see that, but I’m 70/30 Cirillo at least signed off on it. The Genovese’s were willing to take out Vinny (per Massino’s conversation with Barney in MDC before he cooperated) in 03 ish, so why wouldn’t they be willing to take him out in 04 if they thought he had something to do with it? Also, Cirillo was one of the most powerful Genovese members at the time. It’s not like he was a lowly soldier. Lastly, why take the chance if you’re Vinny? If mob protocol is broken and you make a beef to the Genovese family, why not let them take the heat for the hit? Why expose yourself to legal issues when they are supposed to “do the right thing”?

I also just thought, why make the beef at all if you’re going to kill him? If you do it on the sneak wouldn’t you do that BEFORE the Genovese family knew what happened and try to accomplish it before putting a target on your back?

Not saying I have the answers, because I don’t think any of us do. I know I’m expecting rationality from maniacs, but usually I go with the most obvious answer that fits human nature. Dom had to at least know in my opinion.

I purposely left out the greatest potential evidence on purpose and that is the conversation between Massino and Vinny. If you did it on the sneak and could cause problems for your boss you’re probably going to lie about it.

by **AntComello** » Tue Sep 19, 2023 5:13 am

Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 4:35 pm
jmack wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 2:05 pm
Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:58 pm Also interesting, a small blip but it had to do with thinking cirillo son was buried at a construction site Basciano had some control over…so who really did that kid?
Oh boy, you’re going to start a whole debate here…
I know. Been debated for years. I still think gun to my head it was vinny on the sneak. Maybe dominick doesnt even know. Its very serious. Reminds me of gotti on tapes saying “prolly the cops killed this paul.” He doesnt even admit in front of ppl that were in the plot intimately. It was so secret they didnt even talk about it. I dont think Cirillo kills his own kid over it.

Also if Vinny Jr is really made maybe that’s why. Made his bones killing the cirillo kid lol

by **AntComello** » Tue Sep 19, 2023 5:12 am

Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 4:35 pm
jmack wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 2:05 pm
Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:58 pm Also interesting, a small blip but it had to do with thinking cirillo son was buried at a construction site Basciano had some control over…so who really did that kid?
Oh boy, you’re going to start a whole debate here…
I know. Been debated for years. I still think gun to my head it was vinny on the sneak. Maybe dominick doesnt even know. Its very serious. Reminds me of gotti on tapes saying “prolly the cops killed this paul.” He doesnt even admit in front of ppl that were in the plot intimately. It was so secret they didnt even talk about it. I dont think Cirillo kills his own kid over it.

I lean towards Vinny too. But the only thing that makes me second guess that is the fact that cirillo didn’t raise hell trying to find out who killed his kid. Unless he hated him so much and was like fuck it one less problem and he didn’t have to make the call lol

by **Cheech** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 4:35 pm

jmack wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 2:05 pm
Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:58 pm Also interesting, a small blip but it had to do with thinking cirillo son was buried at a construction site Basciano had some control over…so who really did that kid?
Oh boy, you’re going to start a whole debate here…

I know. Been debated for years. I still think gun to my head it was vinny on the sneak. Maybe dominick doesnt even know. Its very serious. Reminds me of gotti on tapes saying “prolly the cops killed this paul.” He doesnt even admit in front of ppl that were in the plot intimately. It was so secret they didnt even talk about it. I dont think Cirillo kills his own kid over it.

by **jmack** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 2:05 pm

Cheech wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:58 pm Also interesting, a small blip but it had to do with thinking cirillo son was buried at a construction site Basciano had some control over…so who really did that kid?

Oh boy, you’re going to start a whole debate here…

by **Cheech** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:58 pm

Also interesting, a small blip but it had to do with thinking cirillo son was buried at a construction site Basciano had some control over…so who really did that kid?

by **newera_212** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 9:23 am

I also love anything like this that shines light on the different factions of the Genovese family. It normalizes them a little bit.

Maybe it's just me, but from the outside looking in, they are always reputed to be this big, unified, well oiled and disciplined machine - at the end of the day they still have different factions of guys who jockey for power and position, still get involved in petty disputes (well, I guess deciding whether a ranking member lives or dies isn't really petty, but still), still have the popular in-crowd, the same politics, scumbag members, etc. as everyone else.

Bellomo also being heralded as the perfect infallible gangster by journalists, some LEOs, mob observers like us here, etc. - it's interesting to see his closeness to knuckle dragging guys like Larca Jr., Balsamo, Hippy Zanfardino who were out there doing shiesty, scummy things . Interesting to hear other perspectives on him and his resume (even if it could be unfounded) , anything that just makes it clear that as smart as he may seem , he's always been a gangster first and foremost.

Things like this kind of normalize the Genovese a little bit - I like it

by **newera_212** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 8:59 am

TommyNoto wrote: ↑Sat Sep 16, 2023 3:38 pm

Also the elevator union beef as I heard about 10 years ago that was still a shady Manhattan industry with no real competition and a lot of Italians

I think the elevators and scaffolding are probably two of the worst, most potentially shady building services type industries going. I'd love for someone to crack into the scaffolding industry in regards to contracts and corrupt city officials. What the city has been doing with local law 11 is fucking unconscionable.

Re: elevators - for whatever it's worth (not much) I know someone through my ex who is a big elevator player and he's an irish guy out on long island , clean as a whistle. Small family owned biz , gets lots of work. Great guy, would be surprised if he's connected (outside of maybe having to deal with ancillary guys in orbit just to do business) - but he has said how 'boxed in' everything is. There's really not a lot of competition in that industry.

Both of those are even worse than garbage hauling IMO and need to be looked at. Produce transport/distribution is a runner up, as well.

by **Cheech** » Sat Sep 16, 2023 10:55 pm

Oh the cousin. Even more dizzying lol thanks!

by **TommyNoto** » Sat Sep 16, 2023 3:38 pm

That was the cousin Meagle beat as Barney was in prison , still a ballsy move but the genius is too smart to beat Barney

Della Cava is very interesting, I didn’t know he was a big drug dealer and it’s impressive he parlayed drugs into building sky scrapers in Manhattan. That 116 crew is something else . 2 of biggest construction players in 1 crew with Joe P / Worth Construction.

Interesting Barney had a lot of say until recently (2005)? Maybe Chin crew had more say then.

Also the elevator union beef as I heard about 10 years ago that was still a shady Manhattan industry with no real competition and a lot of Italians

by **Cheech** » Sat Sep 16, 2023 4:45 am

Dizzying to try and keep up. Amazing orders come down and no one knows from who.

Looks like Ardito was at odds with someone was it Scop? Over interests in CT. Thats why you see Gus Curcio and Anthony Ascenzia mentioned meeting with Ardito.

Also interesting Megale got over on Barney and didnt really give a fuck about it.

by **Pmac2** » Wed Sep 13, 2023 8:11 pm

I remember one of the papers even wrote muscarella turned and his people reached out to capeci to have him write in gangland that never happend and he was away in jail serving his time.

THE BLACK HAND FORUM

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