THE BLACK HAND FORUM

by **OmarSantista** » Fri May 12, 2023 10:59 am

InCamelot wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 1:19 pm Technically speaking if the administration (all 3 positions) alleges that a member is not kicking up his full share, would that member be allowed to have an objective set of ears in the room during that sort of sitdown with his bosses?

This is cool, theoretical discussions like this. I think it's subjective depending on if an admin member (one or more) has a relationship with the member already, prompting him to try to save the member by shelving instead of offing them. Another factor to think about is if this family has a counsel to intervene and have say on the verdict. I believe that if an entire administration alleges an infraction such as stealing on a member, he's probably a goner without being included in any decision making. But if there is a member say on the counsel or a member from the administration then it would be possible for them to bring in the member to the sit down with that counsel or admin member representing them. Or it could be more simple where the admin calls in the member for an explanation which I find unlikely, which is why I say the member would probably not be included in that sit down to defend himself. Would love to hear other peoples theories.

by **InCamelot** » Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:56 pm

Teflon Dom wrote: ↑Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:36 pm I mean most of them probably do. Not like there are receipts. They bring in 50 K and say they brought in 30.

Yeah but I mean situations where the administration actually sat down and grilled the member about it.

by **Teflon Dom** » Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:36 pm

I mean most of them probably do. Not like there are receipts. They bring in 50 K and say they brought in 30.

by B. » Wed Apr 26, 2023 12:58 pm

InCamelot wrote: ↑Tue Apr 25, 2023 1:30 pm
B. wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 10:06 pm Salvatore Mangiaracina stole money from the Bonannos' numbers operation he supervised. Bill Bonanno said a member can't be killed over financial indiscretion so he was shelved and sent back to Sicily (Bill calls him "Sal Amari" in his book but it was Mangiaracina). He was later killed because he secretly moved back to NYC without approval.
Any detail on whether it was him moving back and setting up operations in NYC that got him killed, or was it simply moving back that was the reason?
Fascinating how the mafia utilizes a technicality sometimes.

According to Bill the murder was because Mangiaracina moved back despite being shelved and told to remain in Sicily. Before killing him they verified that the Sicilian mafia hadn't approved his return. There is strong reason to believe Mangiaracina was once a high-ranking Bonanno leader so him ignoring their orders may have been seen as a bigger problem waiting to happen beyond this infraction alone.

He doesn't address it in his book and we lack sources from that era, but the old line Partinicesi didn't fare well under Joe Bonanno's leadership in the 1930s and 40s despite those guys having immense stature between the early 1900s and early 1930s.

by **Pmac2** » Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:08 am

I was watching scars he mentioned joe defede and his son getting caught stealing. It males more sense because defede was almost fininishing his jail bid I'm sure he left his son in charge of whatever he was doing before he went to jail. Then crea probably caught on

by **InCamelot** » Tue Apr 25, 2023 1:30 pm

B. wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 10:06 pm Salvatore Mangiaracina stole money from the Bonannos' numbers operation he supervised. Bill Bonanno said a member can't be killed over financial indiscretion so he was shelved and sent back to Sicily (Bill calls him "Sal Amari" in his book but it was Mangiaracina). He was later killed because he secretly moved back to NYC without approval.

Any detail on whether it was him moving back and setting up operations in NYC that got him killed, or was it simply moving back that was the reason?
Fascinating how the mafia utilizes a technicality sometimes.

by **newera_212** » Thu Mar 23, 2023 2:48 pm

jmack wrote: ↑Thu Mar 23, 2023 2:22 pm

I think it’s circular. I’m sure he “heard rumors”, probably after the fact, but they were the same sources who started the rumor. It didn’t come from an outside source is my point, he was just retelling the same story. True or not I have no idea. I just don’t think logically he has any inside information or different perspective so he doesn’t really establish if skimming was happening or not.

Definitely a good point and a big possibility - not going to say that's out of the realm of possibility

by **jmack** » Thu Mar 23, 2023 2:22 pm

newera_212 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 23, 2023 2:14 pm
jmack wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 2:34 pm
Little_Al1991 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 10:04 am
furiofromnaples wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 6:38 am
Little_Al1991 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 1:06 am Little Joe DeFede, former Acting Boss of the Lucchese Family
I read that Amuso suspected but havent proofs so replaced DeFede with Crea and after the big increase of profits,Amuso was finally convinced that DeFede had robbed.
I think that DeFede doesnt steal but wasnt so good to make money.
Pennisi made a video about DeFede and confirmed that he was skimming
Do you really believe him? Didn’t Defede cooperate in 98? What would Pennisi have been, early 20’s? He wasn’t made until 2013 if I remember correctly. Yet somehow he knows that Defede was skimming? Not buying it.
I don't think I'd believe him if he started telling never heard before stories about Stefano LeSalle or Joe Laratro but when it comes to people that were on the street at the same time as a majority of the people he was closest with, coupled with his best friend being the son-in-law of the Boss for the last 35 years, I'd tend to believe some of the second hand stuff he heard from other members about what was going on in the late 80s and the 90s

I think it’s circular. I’m sure he “heard rumors”, probably after the fact, but they were the same sources who started the rumor. It didn’t come from an outside source is my point, he was just retelling the same story. True or not I have no idea. I just don’t think logically he has any inside information or different perspective so he doesn’t really establish if skimming was happening or not.

by **newera_212** » Thu Mar 23, 2023 2:14 pm

jmack wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 2:34 pm
Little_Al1991 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 10:04 am
furiofromnaples wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 6:38 am
Little_Al1991 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 1:06 am Little Joe DeFede, former Acting Boss of the Lucchese Family
I read that Amuso suspected but havent proofs so replaced DeFede with Crea and after the big increase of profits,Amuso was finally convinced that DeFede had robbed.
I think that DeFede doesnt steal but wasnt so good to make money.
Pennisi made a video about DeFede and confirmed that he was skimming
Do you really believe him? Didn’t Defede cooperate in 98? What would Pennisi have been, early 20’s? He wasn’t made until 2013 if I remember correctly. Yet somehow he knows that Defede was skimming? Not buying it.

I don't think I'd believe him if he started telling never heard before stories about Stefano LeSalle or Joe Laratro but when it comes to people that were on the street at the same time as a majority of the people he was closest with, coupled with his best friend being the son-in-law of the Boss for the last 35 years, I'd tend to believe some of the second hand stuff he heard from other members about what was going on in the late 80s and the 90s

by **InCamelot** » Thu Mar 23, 2023 9:09 am

Mikey Scars vs Gambino admin (mostly Pete Gotti & the Corozzos) might be another example of this.

Sort of broken down here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwV5Xl9ASMc

by **aray22** » Sat Mar 18, 2023 4:27 pm

Browniety86 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:50 pm
aray22 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:28 pm Anthony Seccafico.
Little Anthony was killed for many reasons...

From what I've read stealing from the family was definitely a contributor.

by **Little_Al1991** » Fri Mar 17, 2023 10:13 pm

jmack wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 2:34 pm
Little_Al1991 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 10:04 am
furiofromnaples wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 6:38 am
Little_Al1991 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 1:06 am Little Joe DeFede, former Acting Boss of the Lucchese Family
I read that Amuso suspected but havent proofs so replaced DeFede with Crea and after the big increase of profits,Amuso was finally convinced that DeFede had robbed.
I think that DeFede doesnt steal but wasnt so good to make money.
Pennisi made a video about DeFede and confirmed that he was skimming
Do you really believe him? Didn’t Defede cooperate in 98? What would Pennisi have been, early 20’s? He wasn’t made until 2013 if I remember correctly. Yet somehow he knows that Defede was skimming? Not buying it.

He knew the people who were on the street at the time DeFede was the Acting Boss.
There’s also no reason for him to lie about DeFede

by **Browniety86** » Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:50 pm

aray22 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:28 pm Anthony Seccafico.

Little Anthony was killed for many reasons...

by **CornerBoy** » Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:34 pm

they all steal a little bit but when it gets too obvious......

by **aray22** » Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:28 pm

Anthony Seccafico.

THE BLACK HAND FORUM

Situations of 'Stealing' from the Family

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