by CabriniGreen » Sun Mar 12, 2023 3:54 am
Nasabeak wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 11:10 pm
Ivan wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 7:40 pm
Nasabeak wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 6:00 pm
I am no Gotti fan - but John Gotti actually had a high IQ and you could tell he was intelligent from his letters from prison, if you read them one day. He was no dummy; simply just not educated. But likely of very high raw IQ. Don’t know as much about Peter, but people who knew Peter said he wasn’t that bright iirc Mikey Scars said as much - and he adored John
I think his "raw" verbal intelligence was quite high. You can tell this from some of the weird, funny shit he would say. Like when he went off on his son's friends' nicknames and started making up hilarious fake ones -- that isn't the kind of joke a stupid guy cracks. To me he sounded like a guy with high innate verbal intelligence but no formal education on top of it (as you noted).
Yeah, quite frankly also, many have noted John had a particularly great sense of “sussing out” if you will Mafia politics - the Mafia as we know is as political as a government in many ways - in addition to his noted extremely high charisma (people who knew him stated he was considered extremely charismatic and persuasive even back in the early 60s, before he was anybody)
This innate sense of persuasion and of “reading the room” among a bunch of other just as ambitious guys, and a savvy way of playing politics within said group is an indicator - to me - of quick witted analytical intelligence, besides the verbal intelligence you note. If he was educated, I could easily see Gotti having been a CEO - he had the charisma, social and emotional intelligence, charisma, quick wit and ego to be in a leading position in any organization.
But then, the same is true of many Bosses. Castellano, Costello, Genovese, Accardo could easily have been totally legitimate, high powered executives. These were all men of probably genius or near genius level IQ were it to be tested - just not educated.
Read Gotti’s letter from prison to a soldier stationed in Bosnia that had written to him - for a man of only a high school education, he had quite a way with words.
It's actually funny to me how many downplay the fact that Gotti read Machiavelli... his whole power play.... the way he conducted mafia politics. It's like he through action, repeated the book almost verbatim....
[quote=Nasabeak post_id=255249 time=1678342201 user_id=8048]
[quote=Ivan post_id=255226 time=1678329618 user_id=64]
[quote=Nasabeak post_id=255209 time=1678323639 user_id=8048]
I am no Gotti fan - but John Gotti actually had a high IQ and you could tell he was intelligent from his letters from prison, if you read them one day. He was no dummy; simply just not educated. But likely of very high raw IQ. Don’t know as much about Peter, but people who knew Peter said he wasn’t that bright iirc Mikey Scars said as much - and he adored John
[/quote]
I think his "raw" verbal intelligence was quite high. You can tell this from some of the weird, funny shit he would say. Like when he went off on his son's friends' nicknames and started making up hilarious fake ones -- that isn't the kind of joke a stupid guy cracks. To me he sounded like a guy with high innate verbal intelligence but no formal education on top of it (as you noted).
[/quote]
[b]Yeah, quite frankly also, many have noted John had a particularly great sense of “sussing out” if you will Mafia politics - the Mafia as we know is as political as a government in many ways - in addition to his noted extremely high charisma (people who knew him stated he was considered extremely charismatic and persuasive even back in the early 60s, before he was anybody)
This innate sense of persuasion and of “reading the room” among a bunch of other just as ambitious guys, and a savvy way of playing politics within said group is an indicator - to me - of quick witted analytical intelligence, besides the verbal intelligence you note. If he was educated, I [/b]could easily see Gotti having been a CEO - he had the charisma, social and emotional intelligence, charisma, quick wit and ego to be in a leading position in any organization.
But then, the same is true of many Bosses. Castellano, Costello, Genovese, Accardo could easily have been totally legitimate, high powered executives. These were all men of probably genius or near genius level IQ were it to be tested - just not educated.
Read Gotti’s letter from prison to a soldier stationed in Bosnia that had written to him - for a man of only a high school education, he had quite a way with words.
[/quote]
It's actually funny to me how many downplay the fact that Gotti read Machiavelli... his whole power play.... the way he conducted mafia politics. It's like he through action, repeated the book almost verbatim....