Revisiting Troutman

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Re: Revisiting Troutman

by thekiduknow » Sun Aug 28, 2022 6:35 pm

Thanks Jimmy!

This Vito is Bonanno's uncle on his mother's side. His brothers were Giovanni Bonventre, who often gets mislabeled as his underboss, and Pietro Bonventre who Bonanno lived with I think when he first arrived in America.

Vito's daughter married John Morales.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by jimmyb » Sun Aug 28, 2022 6:23 pm

Outstanding piece! Thank you for putting that together. Please remind me how this "Vito Bonventre" fits into the larger family tree?

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by thekiduknow » Sun Aug 28, 2022 10:47 am

Thanks Chin and Motorfab 8-)

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by thekiduknow » Sun Aug 28, 2022 10:46 am

Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Sun Aug 28, 2022 9:12 am
thekiduknow wrote: ↑Sun Aug 28, 2022 12:49 am There's this mention by the informant I think was Frank LaBruzzo that Armand Pollastrino was really close to Magaddino. Since Pollastrino was in the Galante/Notaro crew, and the hit was given to members of that same crew, I can only speculate that he may have been the one to transmit the order if indeed Magaddino did it without DiGregorio.

Interesting since the narrative is that Galante was a hardcore Bonanno loyalist who hated Carlo Gambino and the Commission for forcing out Bonanno.


Pogo
Other than Notaro and the DeFilippos, the rest of the Galante/Notaro crew were mostly anti-Bonanno. Paul Sciacca, Rusty Rastelli, and Frank Mari all came from that crew and were firmly on the Commission side.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by motorfab » Sun Aug 28, 2022 9:27 am

Great write up kid !

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by Pogo The Clown » Sun Aug 28, 2022 9:12 am

thekiduknow wrote: ↑Sun Aug 28, 2022 12:49 am There's this mention by the informant I think was Frank LaBruzzo that Armand Pollastrino was really close to Magaddino. Since Pollastrino was in the Galante/Notaro crew, and the hit was given to members of that same crew, I can only speculate that he may have been the one to transmit the order if indeed Magaddino did it without DiGregorio.

Interesting since the narrative is that Galante was a hardcore Bonanno loyalist who hated Carlo Gambino and the Commission for forcing out Bonanno.


Pogo

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by chin_gigante » Sun Aug 28, 2022 5:56 am

Excellent write up

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by B. » Sun Aug 28, 2022 12:58 am

Can see Magaddino authorizing Troutman. The level of hatred he had for Bill on the FBI bug is off the charts.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by thekiduknow » Sun Aug 28, 2022 12:49 am

Thanks Antiliar, B. and Tony for the kind words.
Antiliar wrote: ↑Sat Aug 27, 2022 11:14 pm
Great write-up. Very interesting narrative that made me curious about the motive. IMO, from other docs I read I don't believe Gambino or Lucchese gave the order, so Magaddino is the most likely suspect. Magaddino must have really hated his cousin and especially his cousin's son to order their killings (assuming that was the case). Joe Bonanno's claim about wanting to operate through the relatively weak DiGregorio may very well be true. I know that I might hold a minority opinion here, but I believe there's a grain of truth in the Bonanno kidnapping by Magaddino and that it may have (perhaps indirectly) led to the Troutman Street shooting. Besides that, we can see through the ELSURs that Magaddino was not only an authoritarian, but whenever possible expected to be the center of attention. So according to my admittedly speculative scenario, Magaddino grew impatient and frustrated with Joe Bonanno. He had a certain amount of respect for him, but none for Bill. Angry that Joe refused to give up the throne, made even worse when he heard that Bill was the boss of the faction and Joe the consigliere, he decided to have them eliminated.
Good point, there doesn't seem to be a specific motive, at least that was reported. I agree though, it doesn't seem likely to me that Gambino or Lucchese were in on it, although Bill did speculate to the FBI that if the hits were successful they likely wouldn't have made an issue over it(which sounds right to me). Both Bill and the LES seem pretty sure it wasn't DiGregorio, so it was almost definitely Magaddino.

Perhaps worth noting that the meeting was over some territory rights, not overall peace the Bonanno books make it seem like later. That reads to me like tensions had, at least ostensibly cooled somewhat, both Bill and the LES informant mention how Bill was "moving around freely" in the weeks leading up to the shooting. You wonder if Magaddino "pulling" the contracts was a deliberate strategy to get them out in the open, or if DiGregorio was trying to make nice, leading Magaddino to act unilaterally. Personally, I think the latter is more likely.

There's this mention by the informant I think was Frank LaBruzzo that Armand Pollastrino was really close to Magaddino. Since Pollastrino was in the Galante/Notaro crew, and the hit was given to members of that same crew, I can only speculate that he may have been the one to transmit the order if indeed Magaddino did it without DiGregorio.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by B. » Sun Aug 28, 2022 12:39 am

Need to be verified but Bill Feather has Texas guys coming from not only Salaparuta but Santa Ninfa and Castelvetrano. Also has the Campisis coming from Roccamena, Schiro's hometown.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by PolackTony » Sun Aug 28, 2022 12:21 am

B. wrote: ↑Sat Aug 27, 2022 10:47 pm A Dallas CI said they reported to Anastasia before his murder then the Genovese but not positive it was formal.
That’s right, thanks. The Calabrese Connection (Pellegrino, Ianni, Vallone, etc). In that light, the CI stating that Dallas had previously reported to Anastasia would make perfect sense.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by Antiliar » Sat Aug 27, 2022 11:14 pm

thekiduknow wrote: ↑Sat Aug 27, 2022 7:39 pm
Great write-up. Very interesting narrative that made me curious about the motive. IMO, from other docs I read I don't believe Gambino or Lucchese gave the order, so Magaddino is the most likely suspect. Magaddino must have really hated his cousin and especially his cousin's son to order their killings (assuming that was the case). Joe Bonanno's claim about wanting to operate through the relatively weak DiGregorio may very well be true. I know that I might hold a minority opinion here, but I believe there's a grain of truth in the Bonanno kidnapping by Magaddino and that it may have (perhaps indirectly) led to the Troutman Street shooting. Besides that, we can see through the ELSURs that Magaddino was not only an authoritarian, but whenever possible expected to be the center of attention. So according to my admittedly speculative scenario, Magaddino grew impatient and frustrated with Joe Bonanno. He had a certain amount of respect for him, but none for Bill. Angry that Joe refused to give up the throne, made even worse when he heard that Bill was the boss of the faction and Joe the consigliere, he decided to have them eliminated.
PolackTony wrote: ↑Sat Aug 27, 2022 9:11 pm
B. wrote: ↑Sat Aug 27, 2022 8:43 pm A+++

Dallas boss Joe Civello was the cousin of Frank Desimone and his family came from Salaparuta, Trapani. The Desimones were part of Nicolo Schiro's network of influence, so maybe it extended to the Salaparuta guys in Texas. It extended to New Orleans early on via Cipolla and the Civellos had roots in NO. However we know of Joe Bonanno's problems with Desimone so not sure.

Remember too Joe Bonanno said he had his Buffalo kidnappers take him to Texas. While I'm convinced the kidnapping was a lie, did Joe Bonanno actually go to Texas during that time?
The Texas stuff could be a more important part of the Bonanno story in this period than people have realized. Like AZ, Dallas was also an area with a lot of Chicago activity. I’d think that in the 60s this could have also been an arena of tension, like the Western states were. Given Civello’s origins in Salaparuta, I’d guess that apart from NOLA, the families that he connected to were going to be the Bonannos and Chicago (along with LA and probably KC), which seems to be what we see. Do we know who represented Dallas as Avugad on the Commission?
I agree with B. I think it was the Genovese Family. FBI files indicate that Rocco Pellegrino was strongly connected to Dallas, so it's possible he could have been the liaison.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by B. » Sat Aug 27, 2022 10:47 pm

A Dallas CI said they reported to Anastasia before his murder then the Genovese but not positive it was formal.

Wouldn't be shocked at all if Bonanno had it in his mind to take over / influence Texas like he was trying to do Califoria, especially with the Desimone connection. Maybe Bonanno thought if he could take the LA Family from Desimone his cousin in Texas would be easy game. Arizona would be a central location if he was hoping to set up an empire between the SW and S.

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by PolackTony » Sat Aug 27, 2022 9:11 pm

B. wrote: ↑Sat Aug 27, 2022 8:43 pm A+++

Dallas boss Joe Civello was the cousin of Frank Desimone and his family came from Salaparuta, Trapani. The Desimones were part of Nicolo Schiro's network of influence, so maybe it extended to the Salaparuta guys in Texas. It extended to New Orleans early on via Cipolla and the Civellos had roots in NO. However we know of Joe Bonanno's problems with Desimone so not sure.

Remember too Joe Bonanno said he had his Buffalo kidnappers take him to Texas. While I'm convinced the kidnapping was a lie, did Joe Bonanno actually go to Texas during that time?
The Texas stuff could be a more important part of the Bonanno story in this period than people have realized. Like AZ, Dallas was also an area with a lot of Chicago activity. I’d think that in the 60s this could have also been an arena of tension, like the Western states were. Given Civello’s origins in Salaparuta, I’d guess that apart from NOLA, the families that he connected to were going to be the Bonannos and Chicago (along with LA and probably KC), which seems to be what we see. Do we know who represented Dallas as Avugad on the Commission?

Re: Revisiting Troutman

by B. » Sat Aug 27, 2022 8:43 pm

A+++

Dallas boss Joe Civello was the cousin of Frank Desimone and his family came from Salaparuta, Trapani. The Desimones were part of Nicolo Schiro's network of influence, so maybe it extended to the Salaparuta guys in Texas. It extended to New Orleans early on via Cipolla and the Civellos had roots in NO. However we know of Joe Bonanno's problems with Desimone so not sure.

Remember too Joe Bonanno said he had his Buffalo kidnappers take him to Texas. While I'm convinced the kidnapping was a lie, did Joe Bonanno actually go to Texas during that time?

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