Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

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Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by PolackTony » Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:30 am

Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Nov 01, 2021 12:13 am
Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Vito Genovese's parents, Felice and Nunziella/Nunziata (Nancy) Genovese, are both from Campania. Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania, and his wife from Ricigliano, Salerno, Campania.
According to a family tree on Ancestry.com, Felice Genovese's parents were Guglielmo Genovese and Maria Grazia Anna Dislafani [probably Sclafani], and they were from Alia, not far from Lercara Friddi in the province of Palermo (the sources cited confirm this). Nunziella Genovese's parents (her maiden name was also Genovese, so they may have been related to her husband's parents) were Vito Genovese and Giovanina Saroppa (?). So the New York boss Vito Genovese did have at least 50% Sicilian ancestry.

As for the Morescos, it looks like they came from Genoa. On Louis Moresco's gravestone it says he was born in "Genoa, Città Metropolitana di Genova, Liguria, Italy." A Stefano Moresco who was born around 1829 was related and arrived in 1892 on the Werra, and the manifest says he's from Genoa. He could have been Paolo Moresco's (Victoria Colosimo's father) father or uncle. I know there's a Big Jim Colosimo family tree on Ancestry.com that says the Morescos came from Colosimi, but if you check the sources you'll see that none of them say that.
Thanks for the info on the Morescos. The surname is far more frequent in the north so the Genoa origin makes plenty of sense. Seems like Torrio having any familial tie to Moresco is pretty unlikely.

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by Antiliar » Mon Nov 01, 2021 12:13 am

Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Vito Genovese's parents, Felice and Nunziella/Nunziata (Nancy) Genovese, are both from Campania. Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania, and his wife from Ricigliano, Salerno, Campania.
According to a family tree on Ancestry.com, Felice Genovese's parents were Guglielmo Genovese and Maria Grazia Anna Dislafani [probably Sclafani], and they were from Alia, not far from Lercara Friddi in the province of Palermo (the sources cited confirm this). Nunziella Genovese's parents (her maiden name was also Genovese, so they may have been related to her husband's parents) were Vito Genovese and Giovanina Saroppa (?). So the New York boss Vito Genovese did have at least 50% Sicilian ancestry.

As for the Morescos, it looks like they came from Genoa. On Louis Moresco's gravestone it says he was born in "Genoa, Città Metropolitana di Genova, Liguria, Italy." A Stefano Moresco who was born around 1829 was related and arrived in 1892 on the Werra, and the manifest says he's from Genoa. He could have been Paolo Moresco's (Victoria Colosimo's father) father or uncle. I know there's a Big Jim Colosimo family tree on Ancestry.com that says the Morescos came from Colosimi, but if you check the sources you'll see that none of them say that.

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by Moscone65 » Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:44 am

The Barese were the toughest mother fuckers let me tell you

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by Villain » Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:32 am

PolackTony wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:53 am
Villain wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:33 am
Antiliar wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:05 am
Villain wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 3:49 am
Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania.
Do you think there were any connections to Riccas family in Ottaviano since both towns are not very far from each other?
Never thought about it and never looked it up.
Afterall, besides both being mainlanders, they were also both allegedly involved in the Pollaccia hit...
It’s an interesting point. Not only were they both "mainlanders" after all, but compaesani from the old Province of Napoli. I don't know more than the basics about Genovese, but I recall that in 1927 he was visiting jailed Brooklyn Camorra member Antonio Paretti. Given their backgrounds and likely connections to the Camorra, one wonders if "Don Vitone" and "Il Comparello" long recognized each other as part of the "same thing" even before LCN.
Good points and i remember that story about Vito and the Camorra guy.

When De Lucia aka Ricca arrived in NY, all i know is that he was allegedly welcomed by one Gennaro Calabrese, a friend of his family and Ricca took an occupation as a restaurant manager at a joint which was owned by the Gennaro family. Ricca later had the same job but in Chicago at Diamond Joes spot.

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by PolackTony » Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:53 am

Villain wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:33 am
Antiliar wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:05 am
Villain wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 3:49 am
Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania.
Do you think there were any connections to Riccas family in Ottaviano since both towns are not very far from each other?
Never thought about it and never looked it up.
Afterall, besides both being mainlanders, they were also both allegedly involved in the Pollaccia hit...
It’s an interesting point. Not only were they both "mainlanders" after all, but compaesani from the old Province of Napoli. I don't know more than the basics about Genovese, but I recall that in 1927 he was visiting jailed Brooklyn Camorra member Antonio Paretti. Given their backgrounds and likely connections to the Camorra, one wonders if "Don Vitone" and "Il Comparello" long recognized each other as part of the "same thing" even before LCN.

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by scagghiuni » Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:45 am

CabriniGreen wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:34 am
scagghiuni wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:12 am
B. wrote: ↑Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:44 pm
scagghiuni wrote: ↑Sat Oct 10, 2020 2:17 pm johnny torrio maybe was born in lucania but his parents were from the province of bari, he just was born over there, as vito genovese was born near naples but his parents were from sicily
Do you know where in Sicily? Wow, I've never heard this before and that changes my entire idea of his background.
castelvetrano, province of trapani
Dont you think it's pretty weird Bonnano never really mentions Genovese and himself are both Trapanesi? It's odd, right?

Did his family make a total break from Trapani?

I thought Genovese was a common surname in Naples.....
genovese was born near naples, according to some sources i read his parents were from the province of trapani, genovese is a common surname all across italy, anyway the name 'vito' is by far more common in sicily than naples

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by Villain » Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:33 am

Antiliar wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:05 am
Villain wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 3:49 am
Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania.
Do you think there were any connections to Riccas family in Ottaviano since both towns are not very far from each other?
Never thought about it and never looked it up.
Afterall, besides both being mainlanders, they were also both allegedly involved in the Pollaccia hit...

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by Antiliar » Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:05 am

Villain wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 3:49 am
Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania.
Do you think there were any connections to Riccas family in Ottaviano since both towns are not very far from each other?
Never thought about it and never looked it up.

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by CabriniGreen » Tue Oct 20, 2020 4:19 am

Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Vito Genovese's parents, Felice and Nunziata (Nancy) Genovese, are both from Campania. Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania, and his wife from Ricigliano, Salerno, Campania.
Didnt see this before my post.... my bad..

Good stuff..

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by Villain » Tue Oct 20, 2020 3:49 am

Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania.
Do you think there were any connections to Riccas family in Ottaviano since both towns are not very far from each other?

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by CabriniGreen » Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:34 am

scagghiuni wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:12 am
B. wrote: ↑Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:44 pm
scagghiuni wrote: ↑Sat Oct 10, 2020 2:17 pm johnny torrio maybe was born in lucania but his parents were from the province of bari, he just was born over there, as vito genovese was born near naples but his parents were from sicily
Do you know where in Sicily? Wow, I've never heard this before and that changes my entire idea of his background.
castelvetrano, province of trapani
Dont you think it's pretty weird Bonnano never really mentions Genovese and himself are both Trapanesi? It's odd, right?

Did his family make a total break from Trapani?

I thought Genovese was a common surname in Naples.....

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by PolackTony » Mon Oct 19, 2020 6:06 pm

Antiliar wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm Vito Genovese's parents, Felice and Nunziata (Nancy) Genovese, are both from Campania. Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania, and his wife from Ricigliano, Salerno, Campania.
Thanks for the info. Chicago had a bunch of people from Ricigliano, so many that they went by the nickname "Ricis".

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by Antiliar » Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:53 pm

Vito Genovese's parents, Felice and Nunziata (Nancy) Genovese, are both from Campania. Felice came from Tufino, Napoli, Campania, and his wife from Ricigliano, Salerno, Campania.

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by johnny_scootch » Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:10 pm

So Vito Genovese is actually a Sicilian by blood!?! That turns a lot of previous thinking on it's head.

Re: Wiseguys of Pugliese Ancestry

by B. » Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:34 pm

scagghiuni wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:12 am
B. wrote: ↑Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:44 pm
scagghiuni wrote: ↑Sat Oct 10, 2020 2:17 pm johnny torrio maybe was born in lucania but his parents were from the province of bari, he just was born over there, as vito genovese was born near naples but his parents were from sicily
Do you know where in Sicily? Wow, I've never heard this before and that changes my entire idea of his background.
castelvetrano, province of trapani
I def trust you based on what you've shared over the years, but can you point me to where you found that? It's big news for me. I know the Genovese name is found in Trapani (i.e. Joe and Frank Genovese from Castellammare).

That's where Giancana and Accardo's families are from, too. Vito Genovese seems to have run in mainlander circles, but given the Genovese / Chicago relationship it's an odd coincidence.

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