THE BLACK HAND FORUM

Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:13 am

Pete wrote: ↑Sat Oct 03, 2020 11:01 pm Chicago is a non white city as far as crime. The majority of what you said is correct. Different neighborhoods are run by different gangs and have very tight control. Yes they do not engage necessarily in the outfits traditional moneymakers but you can’t compare power. The vice lords, God’s, 4 corner hustlers, then the kings, Spanish Disciples have manpower that the outfit never had. No doubt at one time vena was a very dangerous guy but like my other post said he goes away from violence now

I did a search and according to LE there are 117,000 gang members in 55 known gangs in the city. That averages out to over 2,000 members per gsng.


Pogo

Mustangsally wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:57 am

Moscone65 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:35 pm Tell me what gangs in Chicago are making money from gambling machines, getting kickbacks and preferential jobs from legal companies, or loan out 20k? Wait oh ya, all they mostly do is deal dope and shoot each other

You would be surprised at the fraud and theft activities of so called street gangs. While drugs are their biggest business, they do old school mafia rackets like extortion, underground casinos etc.

There have been around 3,000 people murdered in Chicago in the 5 years. I doubt any of them involve Vena.

Mustangsally wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:57 am

Moscone65 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:35 pm Tell me what gangs in Chicago are making money from gambling machines, getting kickbacks and preferential jobs from legal companies, or loan out 20k? Wait oh ya, all they mostly do is deal dope and shoot each other

You would be surprised at the fraud and theft activities of so called street gangs. While drugs are their biggest business, they do old school mafia rackets like extortion, underground casinos etc.

There have been around 3,000 people murdered in Chicago in the 5 years. I doubt any of them involve Vena.

Moscone65 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:35 pm Tell me what gangs in Chicago are making money from gambling machines, getting kickbacks and preferential jobs from legal companies, or loan out 20k? Wait oh ya, all they mostly do is deal dope and shoot each other

Pete wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:37 pmAgreed but If you look at recent cases today the outfit is a street level organization. The guys locked up now are on state arrests the feds aren’t even doing it anymore that tells you something. And to a previous post about gambling machines and union influence that is mostly gone. They don’t run any unions. They don’t have big time influence again look at the cases. Does the occasional guy get a union job cuz he’s related to Rudy fratto? Sure that happens but it’s nothing like the old days. Now that gambling is legal the licenses are so tough to get the outfit involvement is minimal. People can believe what they want but If you want to “understand the mafia in 2020” do a little research and you’ll see what’s what

Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:39 pm

PolackTony wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:03 amHispanic gangs have been the successor mafia in Chicago for years. Organizations like the LKs and MLDs have membership in the thousands, are vertically organized, have top ranking members pulling in millions from drugs and weapons sales, and have been succesful at laundering those revenues into legit business and real estate as well. They're plugged in clout heavy city and county departments -- Streets and San, Water Reclamation District -- and have long had alderman and other public officials (the longstanding ties between Dick Mell and the MLDs is a great example). In coming years Hispanics in Chicago will continue to assimilate and take on positions of power and influence, and in this way they are following the model set by the Italians before them.

That's a stretch. While there have been examples - mostly in articles rather than actual charges brought forth - of some local politicians seeking to use the gangs to their advantage (and vice versa), it's not like the more direct, more encompassing Outfit-related corruption of old that involved local alderman up the the mayor's office, police and judges, labor unions and city departments, etc. You don't have a single, unified criminal organization like the Outfit was but multiple gangs who fight with each other much of the time. You can't automatically equate Hispanics assimilating and taking on more influence to Hispanic gangs doing the same.

Furthermore, you can look at indictment after indictment involving any gang you want to bring up - Latin Kings, Maniac Latin Disciples, Spanish Cobras, Latin Counts, Spanish Gangster Disciples, Surenos, Nortenos, etc. While Chicago has the biggest gang presence, and some of them are larger and more established than elsewhere, it's basically the same thing you see with street gangs in other cities - primarily retail-level drug dealing, with lesser and more sporadic involvement in things like robberies, burglaries, prostitution, fraud, etc. The Hispanic gangs may have an advantage over the others because they share a language and culture with the cartels who supply the drugs but that's about it. They're still street-level organizations.

Moscone65 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 03, 2020 11:24 am The only wiseguy now from philly that would have ever made it in Chicago or with Genovese is uncle joe.

Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:39 pm

PolackTony wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:03 amHispanic gangs have been the successor mafia in Chicago for years. Organizations like the LKs and MLDs have membership in the thousands, are vertically organized, have top ranking members pulling in millions from drugs and weapons sales, and have been succesful at laundering those revenues into legit business and real estate as well. They're plugged in clout heavy city and county departments -- Streets and San, Water Reclamation District -- and have long had alderman and other public officials (the longstanding ties between Dick Mell and the MLDs is a great example). In coming years Hispanics in Chicago will continue to assimilate and take on positions of power and influence, and in this way they are following the model set by the Italians before them.

That's a stretch. While there have been examples - mostly in articles rather than actual charges brought forth - of some local politicians seeking to use the gangs to their advantage (and vice versa), it's not like the more direct, more encompassing Outfit-related corruption of old that involved local alderman up the the mayor's office, police and judges, labor unions and city departments, etc. You don't have a single, unified criminal organization like the Outfit was but multiple gangs who fight with each other much of the time. You can't automatically equate Hispanics assimilating and taking on more influence to Hispanic gangs doing the same.

Furthermore, you can look at indictment after indictment involving any gang you want to bring up - Latin Kings, Maniac Latin Disciples, Spanish Cobras, Latin Counts, Spanish Gangster Disciples, Surenos, Nortenos, etc. While Chicago has the biggest gang presence, and some of them are larger and more established than elsewhere, it's basically the same thing you see with street gangs in other cities - primarily retail-level drug dealing, with lesser and more sporadic involvement in things like robberies, burglaries, prostitution, fraud, etc. The Hispanic gangs may have an advantage over the others because they share a language and culture with the cartels who supply the drugs but that's about it. They're still street-level organizations.

PolackTony wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:03 amHispanic gangs have been the successor mafia in Chicago for years. Organizations like the LKs and MLDs have membership in the thousands, are vertically organized, have top ranking members pulling in millions from drugs and weapons sales, and have been succesful at laundering those revenues into legit business and real estate as well. They're plugged in clout heavy city and county departments -- Streets and San, Water Reclamation District -- and have long had alderman and other public officials (the longstanding ties between Dick Mell and the MLDs is a great example). In coming years Hispanics in Chicago will continue to assimilate and take on positions of power and influence, and in this way they are following the model set by the Italians before them.