Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

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Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by Wiseguy » Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:37 am

Pmac2 wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:17 amOr did joe just grow out of control so carlo had to put him down
Historical or not, that's been the conventional thinking, i.e Colombo had a lot of support wirh his league the first year, including from other bosses like Gambino. The first rally a lot of businesses, union things like the ports, etc. were supposedly shut down so people could attend. However, all of Colombo's antics had the opposite effect than it was designed to have and the FBI only increased the pressure. The support dried up quickly and, by the second rally, there were significantly less people. Supposedly Gambino and the other bosses told the same businesses, unions, etc. to stay open this time around so people wouldn't attend.

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by Pmac2 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:17 am

Head scratcher is why would gambino kill his biggest allie/ally? On the commission. Did funzi tieri talk him in to it. Did he prefer to have dibella. Rusty and tony ducks both become new bosses in 1973ish why did gambino take out or ok his puppet boss in the other family. Think sam decav. Called Colombo Gambinos puppet 10yrs earlier. Or did joe just grow out of control so carlo had to put him down

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by B. » Tue Jun 02, 2020 6:07 pm

There are a few different versions of the same Scarpa docs, some of them more redacted, so I can't recall if this was in the files Clemente posted or other NARA files, but in one report Scarpa was told (by LoCicero I believe) that they were asking the membership to place their votes for the new boss. Scarpa represented three votes, including his brother Salvatore and another member who were both in prison and couldn't vote themselves.

Scarpa also reported that Joe Colombo was "campaigning" behind the scenes for the boss spot, which was against the rules. However, we know this commonly happened.

From Scarpa's information, it's clear that Colombo was agreed upon by the family captains (and probably the Commission) and the captains in turn asked their soldiers to vote for Colombo, which they did.

So there was definitely an election, but it was more or less rigged behind the scenes with Commission approval. On the Magaddino tapes, the Bonanno representatives who are trying to select a new Bonanno boss (which would be DiGregorio) were under the belief that the Commission appointed Joe Colombo boss, but Magaddino denies this, saying the Commission will only appoint an acting boss if a family is in serious conflict, but the family still must vote for the official boss.

We also know from Magaddino and other sources that Magliocco was forced to resign by the Commission following a Commission meeting where they confronted him and accused him of assuming the role of boss without Commission approval and also plotting to murder Gambino and Lucchese. So Magliocco didn't step down on his own, but under threat by the Commission who ruled against his leadership. To add financial insult to injury, they also forced Magliocco to pay each Commission member for expenses incurred as a result of the meetings/investigation.

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by Extortion » Mon May 25, 2020 7:54 pm

MichaelGiovanni wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 8:41 am
don-shunter wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 7:17 am I wonder if any of the older capos/members opposed Joe's ascension or if they were made promises of more autonomy with their crews if they accepted him as boss?
Someone was recorded on a bug saying that Colombo was nothing more than a bust out guy. Was it on the Gyp Dicarlo tapes? Not sure exactly who said it but I think it was from someone in another family.
Well you gotta start somewhere and he killed 10 people and was a captain. Easily could be boss material.

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by Benandjosh » Sun May 24, 2020 12:24 pm

Probably no coincidence that when Lucchese died in 67, Gambino stepped back from running his family and had castellano running things.

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by Villain » Sun May 24, 2020 12:44 am

Pierino1978 wrote: Thu May 21, 2020 4:43 pm
Villain wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 11:27 am
Frank wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 10:31 am Its been written that Lucchese was the most powerful and or influential NY Boss in that time period.
For what its worth...the Outfit also respected him a lot
Interesting villain where does this info come from ?
I think you can find some stuff on the MF site...the Chi guys also refered to him as Tommy Brown and i think he was close with Giancana

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by CabriniGreen » Sat May 23, 2020 5:31 pm

JIGGS wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 5:25 pm
Frank wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 10:31 am Its been written that Lucchese was the most powerful and or influential NY Boss in that time period.
When I was growing up tommy brown was in one veterans view "the new frank costello." Even though that statement was based on ignorance. Tommy had always been a powerful figure. But from the square citizens p.o.v. mob guys have always been like playing cards in a hand. One alwaus stands out from the pther mo's. By 1953 tommy brown emerged from the public eye as a mr. big. Luciano, lansky, the joe adonis, willie moore and costello are removed from the n.y. 'limelight.' Luciano in italy. Lansky said fuck n.y. and relocates to florida after the senate hearings. Joe adonis was battling legal problems and keeping low profile before he makes his plea deal with goverment to self deport to italy over prison time. Willie went underground litrally. Vito genovese was respected but not yet the power he would become. Honestly don vito was portrayed in the news like a thug. Same with anastasia. The way the media talked about gotti years later. As someone to be feared but not much in the brains department. Joe bananas and profaci were greasers and not viewed by media as good copy. Tommy brown was it. Luchese the boss was described as clever wily a millionaire semi legit. Allegedly the mayor of nyc vinnie impelliteri was tommy browns guy. Allegedly carmine desapio was tommy browns guy. What remained of the tammany machine was allegedly influenced by the tommy brown with costello out the picture fighting i.r.s. charges and the senate hearings charging him with contempt and perjery. Tommy brown was allegedly tight with vito going back to the Masseria-don maranzano era. Dont be surprised if tommy brown threw his support to genovese before vitos rise in 1957. Anastasia who tommy brown allegedely wanted to have killed after the mangano brothers disappeared is hit in '57. Profaci dies in '62. Bonanmo is chased out of n.y. by '64. In my opinion the big 3 in nyc that wasnt in prison during 1963-1965 was #1 tommy brown #2 jerry catena and #the carlo gambino. Thats just my opinion. Fuck you if you get ofended. The luchese family allegedly dominated the garment center. They allegedly controlled idlewild airport. They was allegedly strong in all 5 boros and new jersey plus california and allegedly had the judges & politicians on the hook. Once francesca luchese gets married to tommy gambino it sets up gambino to inherit all a that shit and rival catena and the genovese.

JIGGS
Agreed, like to me, Barzini was Luchesse....or mostly based off him...

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by JIGGS » Sat May 23, 2020 5:25 pm

Frank wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 10:31 am Its been written that Lucchese was the most powerful and or influential NY Boss in that time period.
When I was growing up tommy brown was in one veterans view "the new frank costello." Even though that statement was based on ignorance. Tommy had always been a powerful figure. But from the square citizens p.o.v. mob guys have always been like playing cards in a hand. One alwaus stands out from the pther mo's. By 1953 tommy brown emerged from the public eye as a mr. big. Luciano, lansky, the joe adonis, willie moore and costello are removed from the n.y. 'limelight.' Luciano in italy. Lansky said fuck n.y. and relocates to florida after the senate hearings. Joe adonis was battling legal problems and keeping low profile before he makes his plea deal with goverment to self deport to italy over prison time. Willie went underground litrally. Vito genovese was respected but not yet the power he would become. Honestly don vito was portrayed in the news like a thug. Same with anastasia. The way the media talked about gotti years later. As someone to be feared but not much in the brains department. Joe bananas and profaci were greasers and not viewed by media as good copy. Tommy brown was it. Luchese the boss was described as clever wily a millionaire semi legit. Allegedly the mayor of nyc vinnie impelliteri was tommy browns guy. Allegedly carmine desapio was tommy browns guy. What remained of the tammany machine was allegedly influenced by the tommy brown with costello out the picture fighting i.r.s. charges and the senate hearings charging him with contempt and perjery. Tommy brown was allegedly tight with vito going back to the Masseria-don maranzano era. Dont be surprised if tommy brown threw his support to genovese before vitos rise in 1957. Anastasia who tommy brown allegedely wanted to have killed after the mangano brothers disappeared is hit in '57. Profaci dies in '62. Bonanmo is chased out of n.y. by '64. In my opinion the big 3 in nyc that wasnt in prison during 1963-1965 was #1 tommy brown #2 jerry catena and #the carlo gambino. Thats just my opinion. Fuck you if you get ofended. The luchese family allegedly dominated the garment center. They allegedly controlled idlewild airport. They was allegedly strong in all 5 boros and new jersey plus california and allegedly had the judges & politicians on the hook. Once francesca luchese gets married to tommy gambino it sets up gambino to inherit all a that shit and rival catena and the genovese.

JIGGS

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by chin_gigante » Fri May 22, 2020 12:05 pm

Dick Fusco was Frank Fusco, not Richard

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by NYNighthawk » Fri May 22, 2020 7:36 am

don-shunter wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 11:42 am I've always viewed Lucchese and Gambino as a partnership with Lucchese the senior partner and Gambino the junior. Both powerful and respected but Lucchese had longevity as a boss whereas Gambino was new to the leadership. With Luccheses death Gambino is the top guy.
Was Dickie Fusco actually Richie "nerves" Fusco or his father?

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by SantoClaus » Fri May 22, 2020 6:17 am

I thought Joe Colombo was a killer, with approximately 20 bodies on him, prior to becoming the Don.

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by DPG » Thu May 21, 2020 5:34 pm

Pierino1978 wrote: Thu May 21, 2020 4:43 pm
Villain wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 11:27 am
Frank wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 10:31 am Its been written that Lucchese was the most powerful and or influential NY Boss in that time period.
For what its worth...the Outfit also respected him a lot
Be cool to see the files on this

Interesting villain where does this info come from ?

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by Pierino1978 » Thu May 21, 2020 4:43 pm

Villain wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 11:27 am
Frank wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 10:31 am Its been written that Lucchese was the most powerful and or influential NY Boss in that time period.
For what its worth...the Outfit also respected him a lot
Interesting villain where does this info come from ?

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by B. » Sat May 09, 2020 4:40 pm

Scarpa also reported that Joe Colombo was "campaigning" for the boss position behind the scenes, which was against the rules. Not dissimilar to what John Gotti did, though the circumstances were different. I believe this secret sort of "campaigning" was probably rampant in every boss election despite having a rule against it.

When Magaddino was recorded talking to two Bonanno leaders in 1964, he explained how the family must choose their own acting boss and then vote them in as official boss, and after the family has chosen their candidate it is approved by the Commission. The Bonanno leaders were confused, though, and thought the Commission installed Joe Colombo as acting boss. Magaddino explained that when a family is having trouble, the Commission might appoint an acting boss who then becomes voted in by the family and confirmed as the official boss, and he uses Carlo Gambino as an example, saying that Gambino was appointed acting boss by the Commission because he was already the consigliere and would keep the family together. Joe Colombo seems to have followed a similar route.

^ You can see where someone could interpret the promotion of Gambino and Colombo as the Commission forcing their hand, which they very well might have, but at least in those days the groups still went through the motions of election protocol.

Colombo's predecessor Joe Magliocco was more or less accused of campaigning and setting up a bullshit election to get himself in as boss. As we know, he didn't have actual support from LoCicero, the Gallo faction, and the Carini faction, all of which were actively trying to undermine Magliocco's leadership during his entire run as defacto boss, and Magliocco was never confirmed as official boss by the Commission. Magliocco also avoided meeting with the Commission for an extended point of time after his alleged "election" and this added to his illegitimacy.

Re: Joe Colombo & Carlo Gambino

by TommyGambino » Sat May 09, 2020 4:21 pm

don-shunter wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 11:42 am I've always viewed Lucchese and Gambino as a partnership with Lucchese the senior partner and Gambino the junior. Both powerful and respected but Lucchese had longevity as a boss whereas Gambino was new to the leadership. With Luccheses death Gambino is the top guy.
Agree

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