THE BLACK HAND FORUM

According to Fratianno in his book Charley Batts froze up during the two Tony's hit that was ordered by Jack Dragna

i want to know who the guy D’Arco mentioned in his book as being proposed to be made, and then balked on doing a hit, going to other guys asking them to do it on his behalf. D’Arco said it was the relative of a made guy, and afterwards “the whole family was shunned and they ended up moving away”

Amshire_Ed came up with great topic, although I don't like Borrello as a source. In all the years of guys having to kill, there had to be many that froze, or went into a sort of shock in the days afterwards. The main problem in finding out about it is the D'Arco's and Gravano's all make themselves brave and others cowards when they tell their stories. I got to thinking about if the old timers who had to kill to get made in many cases had more trouble killing or if the newer guys did? At first thought I figured the newer generations would not be a tough in that sense, but then I thought of how most in this generation have way more options in life than the Mafia, but still go into it. Maybe they are quicker, or even anxious to get a killing in. There's no way to know for sure, but I find it a thing to think about.

correct two ,it was joe martinelli

Heathen wrote: ↑Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:33 am In the D'Arco book there's a story of a guy freezing up, same the Calabrese Jr book

in d'arco's book they mention pete chiodo botching a hit because he didn't load the gun correctly

I thought I read Demeo froze after shooting Rosenberg once. He didn’t kill him, so one of the Gemini Twins finished him off?

Fratianno says Charlie Battaglia froze up in the Two Tony's hit and didn't start shooting until after Fratianno had killed them and only fired after Fratianno yelled at him. But it's Fratianno. Fits with every other story he tells where he's the only one who knew how to do anything.

Hired_Goonz wrote: ↑Sun Mar 08, 2020 10:44 pm Didn't Vitale essentially "freeze up" when he let Lino waltz out of the club? He had one job and it was to watch that door.

I remember reading he had a machine gun that night and he accidentally let a few rounds go. Luckily he didn’t hit anyone, he was definitely nervous.

chin_gigante wrote: ↑Sun Mar 08, 2020 2:47 pm If I'm remembering correctly, Vinnie Artuso was a shooter in the Paul Castellano murder but never fired his gun. There's conflicting stories as to whether it jammed or if he froze up

Weren't his nicknames Vinny Jam and Vinny Freeze lol

Didn't Vitale essentially "freeze up" when he let Lino waltz out of the club? He had one job and it was to watch that door.

Rudy Marfeo and Anthony Melei were killed on the orders of Raymond Patriarca in 1968. There were 2 shooters—Bobby Fairbrothers and Red Kelly. One of the homicide detectives said Fairbrothers was so nervous he shot his shotgun into the floor and didn’t hit anyone. And Kelly shot and killed both Marfeo and Melei.

If I'm remembering correctly, Vinnie Artuso was a shooter in the Paul Castellano murder but never fired his gun. There's conflicting stories as to whether it jammed or if he froze up

Yes Valachi talked about it in his book.


Pogo

Gene Borrello said in his most recent interview

Is he going to try and surpass Alite in interviews? Micheal Franzese is another one, they are addicted to doing these interviews. Alite is the most obnoxious.